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I told you all that Lawyer Ron wasn't overrated. Is he in Bernardini's league right now?...no way...I don't think any horse is. But, he is a very nice graded stakes horse that has a very, very promising future. His comeback race was spectacular. He'll only improve off of that start. I am really looking forward to BD's and Sharp Humors returns too. Has anyone heard anything about SNS?
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Despite his own unsoundness ... he sired some very good race horses ... but you're right ... his line seems to not be breeding on ... although such things can be reversed quite suddenly. Antonius Pius and Survivalist may become the greatest stallions in the world. The final chapter won't be written for another twenty years. |
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Chief Bearheart, winner of the BC Turf (G1), Canadian International Championship, etc.. Eclipse for Turf horse Grand Lodge, champion 2yo in GB, Dewhurst S (G1-GB), St. James Palace S(G1-GB), etc.; sire of Derby and Arc winner Sinndar, etc. Be My Chief, winner of Racing Post Tropy S (G1-GB), etc. sire of Donna Viola (Gamely H-G1, etc.), Hail the Chief (Hawthorne Gold Cup, etc.) Azzam, winner of the Sidney Cup (G1-Aus), etc. Istidaad, winner of the Australian Cup (G1-Aus) Chief Honcho, winner of the Brooklyn H (G1), etc. Concerto, winner of the Jim Beam S (G2) and Kentucky Jockey Club S (G2), sire of Bellamy Road (Wood Memorial-G1). |
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Varola was smart enough not to name any living stallions as chefs-de-race in his listings. Or at least none that hadn't had a full career already. Naming horses chefs mid-career has hazards. |
danehill is the sire of rock of gibraltar, as well as cacique, banks hill, dansili, elvstroem, intercontinental, landseer, oratorio....countless others who have earned 6 figures, many millionaires.
as a shuttle stallion danehill has influenced racing from europe to hong kong, from australia to here in the u.s. langfuhr sired wando and mobil....the influence of northern dancer thru sadlers wells and danehill thru danzig is worldwide, and will remain so thru the sons and daughters of those stallions. danzig is the top stakes sire in north america by far. sadlers wells, also by northern dancer, is the top in europe. danehill, by danzig completed the triumvirate in australasia. i'm not sure how much more danzig can do then what he's done.... |
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This is the most awesome thread.
Danzig isn't a great sire????? that is the funniest thing I have ever heard |
from bloodhorse:
Danzig, who was unbeaten on the racetrack for owner Henryk de Kwiatkowski and trainer Woody Stephens, got off to quick start as a stallion with three grade I winners--Chief's Crown, Contredance, and Stephan's Odyssey--from his first crop. As a 2-year-old in 1984, Chief's Crown won the inaugural Breeders' Cup Juvenile (gr. I) and was voted champion 2-year-old male. Chief's Crown went on to become a major winner at three and a successful stallion. Danzig not only led the freshman sires list by progeny earnings, but also that year's sires of 2-year-olds list. Danzig became the first stallion since Claiborne's Bold Ruler in the 1960s to head the sires list three consecutive years. In fact, in the last 100 years, only Broomstick and Bull Lea led for as many as three straight seasons. Danzig is represented by 188 stakes winners(up to 192 as of last week)--tops among North American stallions--and ranks among the leaders by number of Breeders' Cup winners. In addition to Chief's Crown, his son Lure won the 1992-93 Mile (gr. IT). Another son, War Chant, took the 2000 Mile and a daughter, Dance Smartly, captured the 1991 Distaff (gr. I) the year she was Canada's Triple Crown winner and Horse of the Year. Danzig's other top runners include major sire Danehill, English Horse of the Year Dayjur, and United States classic winners Danzig Connection (Belmont Stakes, gr. I) and Pine Bluff (Preakness Stakes, gr. I). Danehill is the all-time leader by number of stakes winners, with 309. Danzig also is the sire of successful stallions Belong to Me and Langfuhr. Another son, Polish Navy, sired 1993 Kentucky Derby (gr. I) winner Sea Hero. For his career, Danzig sired 1,074 foals and is represented by the earners of $101 million. He has sired 107 graded stakes winners and 10 champions. Danzig was bred in Pennsylvania by Marshall Jenney's Derry Meeting Farm and William S. Farish, and sold to de Kwiatkowski for $310,000 at the 1978 Saratoga yearling sale. He raced three times before being retired to Claiborne because of knee problems. Danzig's last foals are yearlings, and there are 18 of them. His 2-year-old crop numbers 30. Danzig will be buried at Claiborne. |
If Lawyer Ron turns out to be the Lost Code or Smarten of this crop, I don't think his buyers will be disappointed. Those horses didn't have A-list pedigrees and they weren't at the top of their generations, but they kept on winning second level races before turning into good reliable sires of racehorses (not sales yearlings).
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Hey, I think Danzig'z grandson Rock of Gibraltar has a solid chance to do something though....we'll see... |
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Now, if you think that Danzig is a great sire of sires, then you may want to try a different sport that you actually know something about.... |
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Your assertion that I know nothing about this sport is ludicrous. Some things I don't know much about are ass-kissing, self-importance, and Louisiana breds. You think you could help me brush up on those? Maybe contact some of your industry experts that I obviously don't have the pleasure of knowing and get your lesson plan together and let me know when to show up. If I had a dime for every "industry expert" I have met, I could buy 50 Louisiana breds. |
AGAIN, I KNOW DANEHILL IS GREAT....I said that early on in this thread. But,l as successful of a racehorse sire as Danzig was and with the book of mares he got the 15-20 years he was in the breeding shed as a prolific stallion - should one top stallion merit him as a GREAT SIRE OF SIRES - I think not...he has been a disappointment to people who understand the breeding industry...just saying....
This debate has clearly wandered away from waht my original statement was about talking about his impact as a SIRE OF SIRES... |
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I love some of the posters in this forum....HI-LARIOUS :D |
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But to be frank, you have no clue of my knowledge of the sport. And being frank again, you are about the same age as I am. And although I'm sure you have gained an absolute lifetime of experience and knowledge in your short tenure of wearing a tie at Churchill, I'm not too keen on taking advice from someone like you. Listen, I have acquaintances who worked with you at the esteemed Churchill Downs. You aren't fooling me with your inspired write-ups for an obscure publication. Go get another job in administration Joel...... |
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Let's hear your dissertation on Australian racing and breeding. |
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I'm still waiting for him to produce the post where he claims that I called Sheikh Mo a terrorist. Hes a liar, plain and simple. I deleted or edited nothing, and the administrators here certainly will be able to determine this. He got emotional, misinterpreted something that i said, then made up outright lies. I really expected more out of him than that. I also expected him to go back and take a look and see that he was wrong. Apparently it would dishonor him too much to do so.
Word of advice while writing for the new gig, don't put words in people's mouths and lie about what they said. Most guys won't give you a second interview if you do so. |
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Have a nice day :) |
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You obviously don't know anything about it, yet you made the statement. A lot of champions do come from that part of the world, Joel. They just stay there and run as champions. Do you honestly think that a race horse must come to America to be a champion? |
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Now this is truly the funniest thing I have ever heard on this thread....this is the quote of the century from you...absolutely the greatest :D :D Your a legend on this chatboard...i wonder sometimes if i come to derbytrail to read about denates and horse topics sometimes - or if i come for a laugh of reading your horse **** :D ....you are only fooling yourself with this comment....this is like Mike Tyson saying that he is disappointed when the tuna companies kill whales.....HI-LARIOUS, Oracle! Keep the fun coming...:D |
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Ok so produce teh alleged quote or quotes then. It should be a breeze. What you are doing is attempting to draw attention away from the fact that you lied. |
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Name two Australian champions that are household names....you cannot...I think that good mare Sunspot (or something) may have been from there but she always cryushed the biys in the Melbourne Cup because it was a ****ty race.... Oh, and I am not pretending to understnd Australian racing other knowing they are small players in the grand picture of our industry - hence the comparison to New Jersey or louisiana programs - or any small programs... |
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Makybe Diva and Phar Lap Or maybe Sunline and Might and Power Zabeel and Strawberry Road. In the picture of "our" industry they might be small players. And the reason for that is that they have "their" industry that they really don't need to compare to ours. The Australians don't need to come up here and run for our purse money...ever. They have plenty of their own. |
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look at the international sires list for 2005 for example. he's third, behind sunday silence and brians time...most stakes winners in europe that year. fourth in '04 and second in '03. the one bright spot? langfuhr finished the year last year as #12 in the sire list here..ahead of the likes of unbridleds song, kingmambo and his 300k stud fee..ahead of pulpit, awesome again, fupeg and hennessy to name a few. was #15 in '04....belong to me #23...ahead of gone west and pulpit.... |
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probably talking about 'the mare' makybe diva, who won three years in a row. she also won the cox plate. that girl was incredible.
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The reason that American buyers don't go buy Australian horses and bring them here isn't because they are not as good as most other parts of the world. You really think South American and European horses are just better than Australian ones, and that is the reason you see a lot of them here? I'm glad you have the assurance of having this figured out, but when you stumble across the real reason, feel free to come back on and explain it to everyone in an editorial. |
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You did notice when Elvstroem won the Dubai Duty Free a year or so ago? Or when the third or fourth best sprinter in Australia, Choisir, went to Royal Ascot and won a G1? Australia/New Zealand is where most of the horses who race in Hong Kong are bred, including Silent Witness. Australian horses run without any drugs and any horse that bleeds after a race is banned from racing after the second occurence. They run on hard, dry turf and wet, soggy turf, left and right handed and down straights, in front of crowds that make ours look pathetic. Racehorses actually race full campaigns and are national heros there, unlike in this country. I realize that the learned gentleman is not about to let a few facts make a dent in his parochial prejudices. But others who read this board may be interested in investigating the racing in a country where the sport still has the status and visibility that it had in this country 60 years ago. |
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Nobody cares about Australasia, honey ... not even the Australasians. Stick to cutting and pasting ... and stop insulting everyone else's intelligence with your fatuousness. |
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Buckaroo sired exactly two male G1 winners ... and Apalachee sired exactly one. Not quite the type of mass production that dynasties are built on ... or which deserve chef-de-race designation. Were they horrible? In terms of establishing or continuing a line ... they sure were. Do you have any other questions ... which don't involve cutting or pasting? |
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... and waiting ... and waiting ... and waiting ... and cutting ... and pasting ... and waiting ... |
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... I think it started with Pedigree Anne ... and spread like AIDS from there. Still waiting for Steve to get that Remedial Reading Comprehension forum going. |
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