I would be interested to know if Klanfer or Simon use 'numbers' and which ones if they do

Many Trainers and stable managers use sheets to place horses in races to run or use them to buy horses,typically early on in their careers based on potential.

I would agree with Steve, in that I really don't get so hung up on the thoro pattern of the universe of horse but rather of the trainers typical MO. I also use the Sheets for horse elimination and or inclusion in exotics vs looking for winners. Another thing you must consider, is that on major cicuits like NY or CA there are many sheet players (TG or Ragozin), so the major coup are harder and harder to find but on minor circuits, the sheets can find you those gems we all are looking for. I also prefer the thoro quicks on the major circuits, but I find the sheet format helpful on the smaller circuits like Beulah for instance, in that you do see patterns and spacing or identify potential or project potential reactions or bounces. You can mathematically calculate the range of numbers for any given field of horses and genrate a range as to where this upcomming race might be run and then try to see what pattern the horse you are looking at projects to run and if that runner fits. I don't base decisions on who to bet on thoro pattern projections. It's more of a nice to have when making your final cuts so to speak.

Anyway, I question the value of the fractional numbers above 5 and certainly above 10. I have a strong belief that the turf numbers are superior and tighter and more transferable track to track than the dirt numbers. (Just my opinion). That is not to say that the dirt numbers are bad or a misrepresentation in any way, more of result of the way turf races are run vs dirt in US.

What could be most helpful to anyone is look back at the past Breeders Cup or Derby Archive files and see what happened to horses going in. Ask specific questions about patterns of upcomming races or those past key races might also be most beneficial.

Look at AQU R6 from yesterday and tell me why based upon TG Figs Baby Yaya should have been 36-1 in that field?

I will be glad to help if I can.

NC Tony

Worst thing about the TG's....seeing how damn slow my horses really are!!!!

The truth shall set you Free!!!

Now where are you placing Achilles of Troy next out?

NC Tony

you got them mixed up....cannon is Chuck...outofthebox is alan

NC, didn't you qualify for the NHC using the TG product?

$25000 nw4L or the Donn Hdcp:D :D

You're right.... I stand corrected.....I'm sorry bout that guys.

Chuck I've seen you place a few nice ones over the past year (Kee opening day of poly meet for one) that seemed very well placed on TG.

NC Tony

Yes I did qualify for the NHC using TG and DRF and another excellent product called HTR. I find, as Steve mentioned, that TG is really good tool in eliminating horses who don't "fit" the given race.

I would encourage any serious handicapper to look at all three products especially, HTR as it provides excellent insight into how a race will be run.

NC Tony

thoro graph
 

NC Tony What is HTR and where can I learn about it? Thanks KP

Here is the website.

http://www.homebased2.com/km/netscapez9987.htm

It has many great racing and handicapping articles to boot on this page.

The software is free, the data is not cheap, but.....well worth the investment in both time and money if you are really serious about making money.

NC Tony

Kenny,

HTR is Ken Massa's handicapping software product... Handicap Technology and Research... LINK: http://www.homebased2.com/km/htrinfo.htm

Another new capping software is Rich Rosa's OS... He gave me a great demo of it at Saratoga. These are like DRF's Formulator, a bit, but with highly adaptable programming nuances to suit your personal playing style(s)..
LINK: http://www.handicappingOS.com

thorograph
 

Steve and NC Tony .. Thank You, KP