what can i say, i'm ahead of my time :D lolz

say i'm wrong about Hard Spun being one of the best triple crown colts in terms of stamina...
What races did he run where he displayed a lack of stamina, that weren't accompanied by poor rides ?

Did the poor rides account for the total number of lengths he was beaten in the Preakness, Belmont, Haskell, and BC Classic?

If anything, the reverse is true. If Hard Spun ever saw out a classic distance, it would have been because of a very clever ride.

I think Curlin was flat out better, and would have won his races if HS had hall of fame rides.

The BC ride is a fine line and I think clever is really the difference there, being a little more patient with a long rein, and making Curlin win by a shorter margin...

The Preakness and Belmont were simply terrible rides to the extent you can't really separate the ride from the performance.

In The Haskell, Hard Spun beat Curlin(in race Curlin did not appear primed for), and they were defeated by a move-up animal. ;)

This thread prompted me to watch a replay of last year's Preakness.

All I have to say is, "Thanks a lot."

That had to be the worst melodramatic call I've ever heard, next to the '87 BC Classic by Tom Durkin. The announcer calls races with too many exclaimation points. Who the hell is that guy?

As you know, DaHoss, there are published reports which state the fact that Curlie was treated with "Winny" last year. Now, given his trainer's long rap sheet of medication violations, do you actually believe that he just got an isolated injection or two of that anabolic steroid during the campaign ... or a number of injections on a more systematic basis (ala Big Brownroid on the "15th of every month") for the purpose of enhancing race performance, among other things?

If you look at his dosage profile, he had a decent ped for distance.

http://www.pedigreequery.com/hard+spun

:zz:

Getting a bit slow in our old age, eh Hossy?

his pedigree may have said 12f, but his running style did not imo. he did very well considering that he probably would have been better up to 1 1/8, but they kept going longer with him.

people keep saying turf miler, why ? ? because everyone thinks it, he was a world class horse on the dirt, and never went on turf, he won the Kings Bishop and was super competitive in the biggest races of the year.

no doubt due to his breeding.

A simple Google search will turn up many articles about Curlie's 'roid use last year, DaHoss.

Sure, 'roids were legal just about everywhere, but somehow I doubt the intention was to make them available so that they could be administered to perfectly healthy, robust horses on a regular, systematic basis. There's obviously no question at this point that they have been abused by many trainers for many years for the sole purpose of performance enhancement on the racetrack.

Like I said before, we know that Curlie received an anabolic steroid last season (likely on a regular basis, in my opinion, because of the way he held up during a very long campaign, his very muscular physique - particularly at the BC, and his trainer's rep regarding drugs), but I have yet to see any kind of evidence that either of his two main rivals were treated with 'roids. In fact, I'd be quite surprised if Nafzger used them on SS, especially on any kind of regular basis. So, in my opinion, you simply can't say with certainty that Curlie was the best of his generation because his performances were pharmacologically-enhanced last year and SS's and HS's may not have been.

As far as Curlie running "a hole in the wind" in some maiden contest, please, there have been countless good runners which have scored big in their maiden race.

Also, you never answered the question I posed in the other post ... do you think Curlie's acceleration issues this season have anything to do with his being off the 'program'? Would he have beaten the G3-caliber Wanderin Boy by six or eight lengths instead of less than one length if he was back on a 'roid regimen?

are steroids tested for in NYRA tracks yet?

now, how can we take your post seriously when you don't call the horse curlie?

Yes it does, DaHoss ... especially for a guy like Nafzger who may've been playing by an unwritten rule and not regularly pumping an anabolic steroid into his animal solely to gain an edge on the racetrack ... only to get nosed in the Preakness (and lose a shot at immortality) by a guy who probably was treating his animal with one on a regular basis.


By the way, Frankel is no angel, but he is on record as saying that he has never used anabolic steroids on any of his horses ... which, of course, includes arguably the best racehorse since 1980, Ghostzapper.

Hard to believe with the way he has his fillies. You could almost make a case that he specializes in big muscular fillies.