Dale Beckner ran 3rd on her at 20-1 at Hia.

Didn't remember that. He won 6 othe other day at Presque Isle. I spoke with him up at the Spa. He's naturally light, and small -- but most of all he's got very, very soft hands. A real light touch.

Eric

LaPenta has been absolutely KILLING it this year, hasn't he??

Farmer has had several "reasonably" priced/homebreds with major success with Zito as well.

I'm most likely looking at this bass ackwards, but doesn't it seem like these guys could afford to be patient with young horses because they "do" continually get big crops and can send a lot of runners to the gate.

It was Jose Martin... Jorge Velasquez rode her, paid $20...

Trainers, to a great extent have to do what owners want. Sure, some can say "Hey this is what your horse needs, take it or leave it" but most (if they want to keep training horses) do what the owners want. Most owners (yes, even the very wealthy ones) want to earn money and or glory with their stables and want to do so fast. They want to win races like the Derby and the associated preps (Champagne, BCJuvie, Wood Memorial, Blue Grass) and guys like Zito, Baffert and DWL have proven that they can do this. If the owner wants to run in those races, that's the track the trainer points them for.
If guys like these say to these owners looking at their 2yo's at Saratoga, "he's a nice colt, I think he might be a nice turf router at age 4" they won't be training for that owner for long!

As for "butchery" a trainer that is a media magnet/media seekeer, is bound to be reported on when one goes bad. It gives the impression that the closed mouth guys (I include Pletcher in this category) never have a horse go bad or fail to live up to promise.
In the last 3 years, two of the most prominent breakdowns were Barbaro and Chelokee, yet Matz is a "fine horseman" and Zito is a "butcher?" Do explain.

Some times we tend to see beautifully bred babies and assume that if they don't pan out, that they were "destroyed" by the trainer. Many of them are just slow. They are not as good as their pedigree and looks would indicate. Hey, Jalil cost $9.7m and was just third at Suffolk to Judith's Wild Rush. Maybe he's just slow!

U r right Jorge did ride her when she broke her maiden. Santos rode her in her first 2 starts. (mdn clm on dirt)

Maybe they should rename the group, Legends with Alzheimers, after they purchased a Closing Argument yearling for 300 or 330k today.

Recent butcher jobs by DWL:

Folklore
Pegasus Wind

Both of these horses went into their 1st races off lengthy layoffs with I believe only 3 workouts, and neither ran after their comebacks.

So he "butchered" them by training them to lightly?

Is Todd a butcher because horses like Ravel, Monba and others have not lived up to pedigree and expectation? What about Mott? Riley Tucker was named for Mott's son, so clearly there was the expectation that he'd be an outstanding colt. McLaughlin? He won the Belmont with Jazil who never won again. Butcher job or just a slowish colt who met the right (even slower) bunch at what is today a freakish distance?

Or are these good horsemen with horses that didn't live up to expectations for various reasons?

Of the 3 "Legends" trainers, IMO, Nick has the best record of maximizing horses with "mid level" valuation, as determined by sale price. Yet even Nick has seen several of his good babies from the last few years failed to train on. That said, several of these are still around and running but for other trainers in more modest races. (Irish Majesty comes to mind.) A few years ago a partnership I'm connected to claimed a horse from Asmussen that he had taken from LaPenta/Zito. He was G1 placed at two and when he looked like he wasn't going to be a graded winner at 3 he was dropped in for a tag. He win 2 allowance races for the partnership and ran until he was 6, when a neck injury of all things, ended his career. It's a testament to Zito's training style that so many of his former "potential" starts are still knocking around at 6 or over and winning races.

He butchered them by racing them in big races off layoffs when they weren't in shape to handle it. Just my opinion, of course. I've never trained a horse.

I dont know if they are picking out the purchases, or if it is Gaines-Gentry.

Thats Bafferts new niche, picking out 5k sires offspring and paying mega-bucks. Wouldnt be surprised if some money wasnt being moved 'under the table.':eek:

It was Mr. Sekiguchi named after FuPeg's owner who probably handed Baffert this horse on a silver platter. I'm sure they don't like turning down an owner willing to send them an expensive horse if only for the gamble that a long term professional relationship could result not to mention that never-dying notion they have that the most expensive might somehow end up being worth it. He did the best he could (the horse was no The Green Monkey, he was just not as good as his price would suggest not that he didn't try hard from what I remember reading). Hideyuki Mori bought him on behalf of Sekiguchi so when did Baffert enter the scene? The colt ran a 1:08 2/5 for 6 furlongs but got a tibia injury. I'll assume he was training in California and this all happened prior to the synthetic installation didn't it? I wonder if that would've affected his longevity, given how fast Baffert works his young'uns.