Let's investigate the stench more closely...Cleveland style. Had 5 more personal fouls than field goals. Shot 37 percent....19 percent from 3 point...5 for 26. It really is amazing that people were giving Orlando no shot this series. Orlando played poorly tonight and Cleveland never threatened them in the 2nd half. OH well, the INdians are only 9 games back on Memorial Day. We turn our losing eyes to them now.

The only advantage Cleveland had in this series was home court advantage. They played great in game 1 and lost a hearbreaker. It's not Earnest Byner fumbling but it is 5 more personal fouls than field goals in a huge conference final playoff game. (byner fumbling was overrated. They just would have lost in overtime regardless...as they did the previous year.) I'm not seeing much difference in this game and the Byner fumble. the Byner fumble was the penultimate game as this is the penultimate series. Again, losing this series is better for me. It would be much worse to lose game 7 of the finals at home which would happen.

I'm fine. It's simply standard operating procedure. Anything else would be more shocking than simply more losses. Believe it or not, this was the best game they have played in Orlando this year. They weren't really threatening to win, but it wasn't a complete blowout either like the other two.

LOL.

Ariza is shooting 51% from three point land and 55% from the field while making two decisive plays to help win games.

West is shooting 40% from the field and 33% from three point land and has been insignificant on the offensive end in this series.

You are a silly, stubborn man that loses a ton of credibility by sticking with these hopeless positions.

what say you on the bets...i need more money!

LOL. what is your opinion of trevor ariza? are he and delonte west on the same level as offensive players?

I don't follow the Lakers. They are meaningless to me as is that series. Delonte gave my 4 kids autographs in Salt Lake this year with a broken wrist at the time. He was somewhat understandable as well. I have a soft spot for the guy. So it is unfair to ask me comparisons. I think West plays well. Ariza has looked better in the conference finals without question however. Ariza has played better in the conference finals. over the whole season I have no clue what Ariza does.

Goodness. I looked at the Lakers season stats, and I think it would be idiotic to compare their stats. Of course West plays more minutes so of course his scoring would be more....but their field goal pct was the same and West was far, far higher in 3 pt and free throw percentage. I would say Ariza is just having a good series is all. West not so much so far.

He has played better. Only cannon would deny that. I think they are about equal just with different roles. West is playing better defense now than he did when Gilbert use to torch him. He has played very well against turk although they are giving him a lot of help. Ariza has picked it up against carmello and i dont think anyone would confuse turk with as being as tough a cover as melo.

Overall, they are both role players with no real advantage overall.

Interesting about the minutes. Despite playing ten more minutes per game, he averaged less than 3 points more and fewere steals, rebounds and blocks!

West is better. But Ariza is simply playing better offense THIS series, mainly I think because Denver is not a good defensive team...Orlando is. I mean you can bend stats any way you want them. Wallace and Varejao shot 75 percent combined tonight. That doesn't mean they are good shooters as all 3 shots they made were layups. And you don't want them taking 25 shots combined a game. You still want all your shots coming from James, WEst, Williams, Ilgauskas regardless of whether they are making them or missing them.

but to take this one series and state flat out Ariza is better is ridiculous.

Ariza's taking more shots per minutes. Who cares? Delonte West is a 6'3" guard, how many blocks is he supposed to get??

I didnt say he was better. I said they were about the same player.

Ariza is a 6'8" forward, West is a 6'3" guard. What are you talking about they are the same player??

Meaning they are both going to give about the same contribution overall if in different ways. Both are good defenders. Both are relied upon in their respective offenses as spot up shooters. Both will give you around 10 points per game. Delonte is better off the dribble and in the half court, Ariza fills the lane on the break much better.

Look at stats for the entire playoffs. Virtually the same and i think houston and utah play better defense than detroit and atlanta at this point.

Utah plays zero defense. I would not contend they play better defense than Atlanta. That is just silly claiming Utah plays better defense than Atlanta.

detroit and atlanta are 11th and 12th in defensive efficiency respectively. Utah was 14th...houston was 7th.

edit* remember also that Utah's best interior defender was out for a good part of the year. At wing, brewer and kirilenko would be the matchup and both are good defenders.

Don't forget also...West broke his wrist and his offensive stats went down steadily upon his return working back into the rotation and offensive flow. This did happen.

It's pretty much arguing about nothing. I don't really care. It's depressing enough regardless of whom is better between Ariza and West. I honestly don't give a rat's ass who is better. The Cavs are in massive trouble. They got the poor shooting effort from the Magic I felt they needed to steal one in Orlando...they didn't take advantage. It's depressing. This side argument is meaningless.

Okay, and Phil Jackson experimented with a million different rotations to begin the season and Ariza's role wasnt defined until the second half of the year.

Im not talking about all of that though. I am talking about what they are...now...in these playoffs.

West has been a decent offensive role player that has played good defense. Ariza has done basically the same thing.

How is this debatable? Im not saying Ariza is better. Im just saying in terms of "value" they are about the same player.