Absolutely racing depends on gambling dollars; no question. But if racing decides it just needs gambling dollars, there's no reason to worry about track attendance, because now that you can gamble from your living room, why even bother going to the track? If going to the track is to be promoted as a worthwhile way to spend the day, racing must work to attract more than just the serious bettors. Because handicapping a race is a lot harder than feeding quarters into a slot machine, and you don't get any of the satisfaction of blinking lights and pinging noises. (pause for sarcasm moment, as I hate slots)

The other food options take a while to find at Belmont and AQ, and they're still not very good. Well, okay, the buffet at AQ is pretty darn decent, but it's pricey and on the third floor and then it's not convenient to go back down to watch the races in the open air. Food and stuff to look at needs to be easy to find for the casual visitor.

You're right that racing is a different sport from any other in that it is based on gambling, and that is part of the image problem it faces- we're a Puritanical nation and vices makes us uncomfortable to talk about, much as we're all happily indulging in most of them when the minister isn't looking, so to speak. Casinos are thriving, yet I notice most of the ads for them on TV tout them as destinations, with dining, and shopping, and stuff to do besides feeding quarters into the one-armed bandits. To see an ad for them, you'd have no idea you were going there to gamble, and yet the casinos know that people, once there, are going to be gambling.

Racing used to have the gambling market to itself. Now that it doesn't, it needs to figure out a way to present itself as the most appealing gambling option to people, and that probably means expanding past "Go Baby, Go."

Notes from a Two Bit Gambler
 

The following reflection on yesterday resulted from reading a post from the deservedly well respected host of this site.

The royal we you used Mr. Host to describe those who agree what a magical day it was is indicative of the blur of your perspective. As the racing game is your source of income, you rightfully fear its tarnished image and eroding popularity more than those who are not so closely attached to the sport.

I attended the same racebook for all three triple crown races. When they load the gates for the derby that place is a madhouse every year; when they loaded the gates for this year's preakness, that place was a madhouse; when they loaded the place for the Belmont yesterday, it was like a typical early summer saturday at the racebook: as soon as the race ended, people turned their focus immediately to the next at Betfair and Golden Gate.

You and your girl having some great time at some racing industry dinner is fantastic and all for you I guess, but how that makes for a magical day of racing is really difficult to comprehend unless it was meant for your Facebook page and you accidentally posted it here. The reality was that it was an average card and an average day of racing. Unless we get a great crop of three years olds, for example the Curlin crop, the Breeders cup has more or less supplanted the Belmont as the third biggest day in racing in the States.

As far as the fight goes Calzone, Teddy Atlas described it correctly when he said that Bradley's style made him a sitting duck for Pac Man's straight left hand. Anyone who watches that fight closely will see that Bradley was so limited in his skill set that anyone who forked over $55 to view this mismatch had been taken. To make matters worse, Pac Man knew very early that this guy wasn't in his class, so he coasted for extended periods, especially the last two rounds. Bradley gave what his limited skill set allowed him to give, which was very little, but when a guy never hits another guy with one meaningful shot over 12 rounds, I am not sure how such a fight is worth the price, especially when the money guy subconciuosly says screw it I ain't taking this guy out tonight and he can't hit me - f****** coast home.

I bet on Bradley at plus 350, a terrible terrible bet fueled by that 24/7 HBO bullshite. So outclassed was Bradley that the wife and I didnt even bother to stick around for the decision, left right after the 12th round. I had it scored 9-3 Pac Man. I laughed when I came home - a gift from organized crime syndicates. Made up for the Celtics collapse and the Kings lackluster effort.

There was no magic yesterday if you want the perspective of a two bit gambler; rather, a f****** grinder saturday. Made lots of mistakes. Chalked it up to the early morning racing, which I partake in about four times a year, and playing scared. Keyed four horses in the double in front of the Flower Alley lone speed. Buried my nose in the form again a few minutes before the race and told this retired old man handicapped handicapper buddy of mine that the only three horses you need in this race are the 2,4 and 6. I asked him who he used in the pick 3. He said 6 & 10. I played another double using the 2,4, & 6 to his 6 & 10. As I was walking back to the table I buried the nose in the form again and asked how did you not use this 3? This horse is sharp as f***. Some humpbacked f*** mumbled "damn speed" 100 yards from the wire, right about the time the first time turfer, the 4 horse, kicked into another gear to nail the Flower alley on the wire. I sat dumbfounded as I realized I had no exacta box, no tri, nothign but a double going with the 4. /when the 3 broke on top by 2 lengths I knew I was f****** and the gods were enjoying themselves at the expense of my stupidity. Rallied and hit the Pick 4 that closed with the Belmont, Should have singled Trinniberg at hit it for a couple of dollars. Another mistake. The biggest mistake was sticking around for a track I abhor, Betfair. They took a benjamin from my pocket in about an hour. Left there and took in the evening sporting events described above.

If any magic occured during the day Mr. Host, it occurred when the humpack - a disabled construction worker with both a literal and figurative broken back - muttered "damn speed." Many on this board felt the pang of Cosmic Irony triggered by his words, words meant to accept defeat for him but foreshadowing a gut wrenching defeat for those on this board who were set for a real nice score.

No sir, you and the other suits mentally masturbating each other while you sit around imbibing at the open bar and smoking a gar after a tremendous meal is not a magcial day. The event was lost when the horse wenrt wrong. You cant recover the magic by elevating some dinner with suits or suggesting the electricity of the crowd. Come on, sir. Child please.

Good luck to all over the summer. See you in the fall as the Breeders Cup nears.

PR

Because he lives in Louisville?

Wow man, bad day?

How's Gator doing?

There are a lot of logistical challenges facing horse racing from racing dates, calendars, simulcast pricing, rules/regs etc. yadda yadda yadda.

But, if there is one thing I've learned here at LAD is that there are lots of people out there who want to learn horse racing, who want to become involved, who want to gamble more... but they find the sport too intimidating. The language, the terms, the past performances - it's an awful lot to someone.

I'm admittedly proud about this "Beginners Wall" we put in at LAD before the meet. The folks downstairs tell me that not a day goes by where patrons aren't stopping to take a picture or look, read and learn. And most of those doing the reading are young, too. I think the response its received is a big indicator into where racing needs to focus some of its effort.

I had a good time yesterday until they hit the wire in the big race. Then I was virtually raped and felt used watching a rat who isn't close to being bred for the distance and was the ultimate money burner.

Now I still hate this sport because I GAMBLE. Nothing is worse from a gambling standpoint.

5/2 winning a slow classic race. It's sickening.

Glad you guys love chalk and had a good time.

I think your first sentence has a lot more to do with the issues then the rest. In some areas betting on horse racing is very easy, in other areas not so much. Racing is not reaching its potential audience with modern technology and until that changes I don't see how it can grow.

It can be intimidating and the wall is great but honestly if someone has a slight interest in learning to bet horses and the internet getting the information really is not that difficult. I think it used to be much more so than today, I honestly did not learn that much in my first 10 years following the sport compared to the next 10 with the internet. One could read Andy's or Drug's articles and learn about the sport in ways that just were not available 20 years ago.

Appreciate the passionate comments. Actually, it sounds like you're as devoted to the game as I am, but you clearly don't know much about me, where I come from, how I derive my income, who my friends are or anything else.

Sorry you had a bad day.

Yeah ok Mr Host...

Gotta admit the guy worked his ass off to get in a redboard about winning a bet on the fight. Very Very creative. :tro:

I think that what happens a lot of times is people use the wrong word in describing how they feel about something. I'm going to guess that Kasept didn't mean that the racing itself was magical. How could he? It was average at best but that doesn't mean that the whole experience itself couldn't have indeed been magical. First of all, just being in NY can make it a magical experience. I love that place. Then being there with a ton of people having a shared experience increases the enjoyment of the moment. The day went smooth, the races went smooth, the Belmont made up for its lack of quality with an entertaining finish. Overall, the day had to go as well as it could have under the circumstances and considering how many times that doesn't happen in this sport, just to have that happen has to be considered magical.

How is the handicapping class at BPCC coming along?

:D

Great... the goal is...

Fan -> Handicapper -> Gambler -> DT Member.

In all seriousness, the mix of students is amazing.

75-year-old lady.
30-year-old guy.

And everything in between.

He is no redboarder.

notre dame
 

i will say this, there is a humpback who was one of the bigger Jonahs I've ever seen. Could be the same guy. They really shouldn't be allowed at the track. That goes for those bad luck midgets too. I've broken my hand twice on those hard heads of theirs. I've since switched to open handers. They don't hurt as much but add that humiliation factor into the mix.

I've been teaching my boyfriend about racing and it very hard to not overload one with information, both in analyzing form and in actually placing bets. You've put up a really great effort here. :)

Travis is all about effort. He does a very good job in a lot of areas.

Good thread and discussion.

This was my fourth Belmont in person, and second non-Triple Crown chance Belmont. In this day, when 85,000 people show up to the track, and you figure maybe 30,000 REALLY know what's going on (the class of the races, all the players in the bit races, etc)...that is a special day.

I watched races from many different places throughout the day, and a few things I noticed.

- The crowd was INTO it, and you knew most of them really didn't know what was up. Spontaneously cheering during post parades, every race went off with a magnificent degree of excitement. A TON of young people there, many enjoying the day out and the atmosphere.

- It is so much easier to be involved in the racing at Belmont than the other two TC venues, and that is so easy to see. If you are in the backyard, it's tough to avoid the paddock, and after that, you are either in the grandstand or on the apron.

- Almost all the races had very good finishes, and the crowd got into that even more.

- Steve uses the word "magical," and it is, to a degree, very understandable. There were a few times when I found myself incredibly surprised by the crescendo of excitement in the crowd. Everyone I saw really seemed to want to be there, and enjoy the day. I'll Have Another not racing may have dimmed the numbers, but tough to say many didn't walk away satisfied with the experience.

- I was walking to the paddock for the Manhattan, and the line for the ATM in the 3rd floor grandstand was literally 40 deep, when I got to the clubhouse escalator down, a different ATM line was maybe 20 deep. Maybe they were just buying drinks with that cash, but who cares.

Saratoga, Del Mar, and Keeneland have created an atmosphere of an all-day, every-day experience at their meets. Their meets are limited, festival-like experiences. They treasure fashion, partying, fun, and every time I've been there, seen scads of under 35s having a great day out - they are enjoying the full experience, and two of those tracks are actual destinations, the other being in a town built around the thoroughbred.

Every other track on this continent is up against it when creating an experience, but many tracks do it well for a day or three, and that's it. That's the hurdle.

I thought Saturday was an incredibly enjoyable day, and I found myself surprised and heartened by the experience.

Yeah Travis, that wall is a great idea and you deserve to be commended for it.

If you really think about it, open up a form and pretend you have no idea how to read it. It probably looks like a different language.

If everyday above ground is a good day, then a racing day with 6 stakes and 85,000 attendees cramed in to watch them all is one heck of a "Magical day"

Rock on, Steve....

Right On Steve!!!!!!
 

Well said as always, Steve :) it was my 1st Belmont Stakes and enjoyed the day thoroughly also.......the sport of thoroughbred racing is ALIVE & WELL :{>: those who do not think so.......well should find another form of entertainment or type of gambling! ;) frankly, I'm REALLY sick and tired about those who CONSANTLY hammer OUR sport :mad: to them (whom ever they are or have a forum to write) PLEASE GO AWAY!!!!!! If no one can find passion about something they love, thier lives must be pretty empty.........

You need thing like Exchange betting, in-race betting, and low takeouts and you won't have any hurdles.

The true hurdle is that the public views horse racing as a "sucker" game -- and they view fans and bettors as old men with disposable time and disposable income -- a mix of degenerate gamblers and uncool well-off snobs.

The general public doesn't believe they could make any money betting horses -- and they probably don't know anyone who makes a living betting horses either.

The festive atmospheres on big racing days will always attract people who want to hang out, socialize, and drink. Serious bettors will always bet a lot more money on big racing days because overlays are easier to find.

Unstoppable U was 11/1. No horse in the entire Belmont field went off at odds higher than 27/1 -- and five horses in that field were clearly over 100/1 true odds. The people who showed up and threw money away on hopeless longshots aren't the people to go for. It's the people who don't ever show up -- but who would become very useful fans and bettors who follow the sport 7 days a week if the climate was right for them.

I did a fantasy football draft last year with 13 other guys...all in their 20's or 30's. It was just $100 to get in -- and the prize money was stinking $1,400. Everyone had laptops with them, everyone came with strategies, people bought books and made sheets for this stupid thing. I was BY FAR the least informed person in that basement. After about 12 rounds -- I didn't even know the names of any players left.

These are 13 guys that all live within about five minutes of me -- that could be serious and USEFUL horse racing fans and bettors. They're not the ones just showing up and betting $20 on Guyana Star Dweej at 23/1 odds and having a few drinks. Who cares about those people? You're simply not going to get them to follow the sport and keep coming back to the racetrack.

You can spend 50 dollars on past performances in a day...yet the overall tone by fans like us is hey if you can't afford 7 dollars for a racing form then pi.ss on ya.

Well it's not about affordability. It's about catering and marketing to consumers. And quite frankly there isn't an industry much worse than American horse racing.

Just look at Australia. Plenty of information available for free, on the web, from major handicapping sites in that country.

South Africa doesn't do a shabby job either.

It's silly to charge for past performances for a sport that has such a high takeout. This was avoidable years ago. During the time Doug wishes he lived in.

I was on the escalator during the mid-part of the card, heading up to 3rd floor, and guy in front me says..."you look like you know what you're doing, any suggestions where to watch the race from?"

He was one of four siblings who came out to the races, two guys, two girls, probably from ages 20 to 30. The one girl lived in NYC, the brothers lived in Jacksonville, and the other sister lived in Dallas, they were all in town for oldest sister's 30th birthday. The one who lived in Dallas had been to Lone Star Park once, and suggested it would be a fun day out.

I gave them some recommendations on where to watch the big race, then asked if they had bet yet. They said they hadn't, and wanted some recommendations. Asked how much they wanted to bet, and suggested pooling their money and trying to get a small trifecta together.

The thing that was unavoidable to me, however, is that the person who spurred them all to the track was the only one in the group who had ever been to the track before, and it was just a single visit at Lone Star on a non-descript night, according to her at least.

Bring some friends, get em involved...see what happens.

Given a climate of betting exchanges, in-race betting, and low takeout -- it wouldn't be long until the sport would become absolutely infested with people like this:

Fantasy Sports geeks that number in the millions:






Young people who have been lured to Poker:








Wanna-be Day Traders who watch Jim Cramer on Mad Money and on and on.

On Friday night I went to the Meadowlands with Heels and BT. We were outside and they had a band, $2 beer special and betting promotion. They had a jockey come over and he and a track handicapper rounded up people to throw in $5 each. They were helping people handicap and betting a group P4 with the money collected. Fifty-one people participated and the group hit the P4 for over $17,000. Many of these people were very excited about winning $244. Some of these people will tell others and come back.

This type of promotion can be easily run at every track and it drums up interest in the game and more importantly interest in gambling on it.

Tioga Downs has a flea market and inside antique sales every Sat/Sun 9-5pm.

Good to know.

can you, uh, tell us more about this mental masturbation? not for me, i'm asking for a friend.

:tro: Good one Steve - exactly - a lot of us who watched it on TV were still excited. Many I've talked to this weekend said what a good matchup it was in spite of IHA's absence.

Interesting thread.

I completely understand Steve's comments about Belmont Day. Being a Maryland owner and resident, I felt exactly the same way on Preakness Day. The only way I could have felt more proud that day was if I had a horse running in one of the races - any of the races - that day. I didn't care what the final times of any of the races were, or what the class of the race was, it simply was a wonderful day to be a MD'er, an owner, and to be at Pimlico.

It sucks to see too many bashing Belmont Day just like they did Preakness Day.

The best thing racing has going for it are the bettors. The worst thing racing has going for it is the bettors. How do we reconcile that?

Steve,

Allow yourself to describe a great day at the track as you deem appropriate. Those of us who have not only a firm knowledge as well as a deep seated passion and love for the sport, and the equine athletes that compete understand exactly what you meant. Anyone who knows this sport beyond a racing form or a betting window know just how fragile these animals are and that this sport can have the highest of highs and the lowest of lows.

As far as previous comments, what you would call passion, I would call ignorance....

Sounds like Bell Bends Boy move to Brittan and had another shizzy day at the windows

Hey, come for the flea market, stay for the

I saw no one here bash the Belmont day -- and certainly I don't know of one person or one entity that has bashed this years Preakness day.

Big crowds and festive atmospheres are fun. I remember going into the infield on Preakness day the year Point Given won and I loved it. Good looking college aged girls were being hoisted up and showing their tits every few minutes in different ares. I saw fights. I've been to toga parties in highschool that were way more civilized. It was wild.

I've been to the Derby five times. Great atmosphere. I've been to the Travers a couple times.

In the 1930's -- they'd get crowds of over 200,000 people on Ascot Gold Cup day and the environment was famous the world over.

You need 7-day a week fans who bet. Not people who want to drink and socialize and show up for big events three or four days a year and maybe bet $20 on a slowpoke like Ravelo's Boy who hasn't raced in 100 days.

They like to talk about "reaching" the new fans who show up for these races -- well that's good and I know they can do a better job of it. However, the people who they need to get are the people who aren't showing up at all on those days and have no plans to show up at a racetrack anytime soon. These are people that barely know horse racing exists.

In theory, It's very simple and obvious how you get them in force. You detach the "sucker game" label that haunts this sport. Doing this will also greatly empower the current bettors.

I tried to restrain myself from not saying anything in this thread -- but nothing is going to get better if people with vocal platforms want to make it a stride-for-stride myopian Us VS PETA and Us VS The NY Times argument.

Steve said I missed his point -- and I think he was also getting at those who thought the Belmont day would lose some of its sparkle without I'll Have Another running. I guess that's what the magical day stuff was about.

Which previous comments?

I just threw up in my mouth.

There's only one time a year when a Belmont is going to have numbers like that, so it has to make some sort of push to get some repeat buisness.

My question is, how do you detatch the Sucker Game label?

not yours

Doesn't every gambling endeavor have the sucker label? I like Frank's idea of a horse racing lottery with huge payouts. But the politics won't allow it because lotteries are run by the states and they don't want that type of competition. The Rainbow 5 and the Super High 5 are steps in the right direction that lottery players may be able to get close to if it's promoted.