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-   -   12/26 (SA): Malibu, La Brea (G1's); Beaufort (G2); CA Champion (R) (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=40127)

Sightseek 12-26-2010 06:03 PM
What a day by Sadler!

JerseyJ 12-26-2010 06:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sightseek (Post 736953)
What a day by Sadler!
What a day for cheating scumbags that is...Smiling Tiger was so much the best there...chased Alcindor, put him away decisively, and just missed while running fast the whole way around. What a lucky, perfect trip there.

Sightseek 12-26-2010 06:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyJ (Post 736955)
What a day for cheating scumbags that is...Smiling Tiger was so much the best there...chased Alcindor, put him away decisively, and just missed while running fast the whole way around. What a lucky, perfect trip there.
I would have preferred Tiger, but you can't take away that Sadler swept the 3 stakes with big performances. Though it is sad that they are actually counting Twirling Candy as having beaten Spectacular Bid's track record. I'm happy to have dirt back though.

Alan07 12-26-2010 06:07 PM
Did they move the Gulfstream timers to Santa Anita?

Kasept 12-26-2010 06:12 PM
Heard from Jay Privman on site that they're going to be re-checking all the timings.

SCUDSBROTHER 12-26-2010 06:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasept (Post 736963)
Heard from Jay Privman on site that they're going to be re-checking all the timings.
Should check blood.

my miss storm cat 12-26-2010 06:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by my miss storm cat (Post 735906)
Sebastian, Nextdoorneighbor, Blue Panis...

Maybe I'm insane for thinking any of them could win this but I do.
:rolleyes:

The good news for me is that I didn't play this race.

The bad news is I was all over Caracortado. :wf

Riot 12-26-2010 06:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasept (Post 736963)
Heard from Jay Privman on site that they're going to be re-checking all the timings.
Maybe they can go to a 3 1/2-inch cushion to take some of the "speed-favoring concrete highway" away :D

SCUDSBROTHER 12-26-2010 06:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by my miss storm cat (Post 736968)
:rolleyes:

The good news for me is that I didn't play this race.

The bad news is I was all over Caracortado. :wf
Timid lil ride. Still finished where he was gunna finish. He's all racehorse.

Sightseek 12-26-2010 06:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot (Post 736973)
Maybe they can go to a 3 1/2-inch cushion to take some of the "speed-favoring concrete highway" away :D
Closers are doing well on it.

Riot 12-26-2010 06:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sightseek (Post 736975)
Closers are doing well on it.
Thirtyfirststreet.

VOL JACK 12-26-2010 06:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GPK (Post 736900)
I know the talk was about the track being faster after all the rain, but that time is insane no matter what:zz:
I loved them comparing today's crazy times with what Spectacular Bid did back in the day.
Facepalm.:o

VOL JACK 12-26-2010 06:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasept (Post 736963)
Heard from Jay Privman on site that they're going to be re-checking all the timings.
there were some very quick 2nd quarters in the sprint races.
I was skeptical as well.

Kasept 12-26-2010 06:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot (Post 736973)
Maybe they can go to a 3 1/2-inch cushion to take some of the "speed-favoring concrete highway" away :D
You don't know what you're talking about. Sorry.

Riot 12-26-2010 06:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasept (Post 736986)
You don't know what you're talking about. Sorry.
I know today the track was advertised as having a 3-inch cushion, and the track sure seems to be carrying speed from what I've watched. Sorry for daring to have an opinion. Not. There are multiple horses today that have outrun their figures. Maybe it is a timer problem. Or maybe the track is pretty darn firm and fast.

Dahoss 12-26-2010 06:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot (Post 736989)
I know today the track was advertised as having a 3-inch cushion, and the track sure seems to be carrying speed from what I've watched. Sorry for daring to have an opinion. Not. Maybe it is a timer problem. Or maybe the track is pretty darn firm and fast.
Considering how much it rained you have to think they did everything they could to try and get the surface fast for opening day. We see this all of the time.

It wasn't speed favoring though...not even close. The results back it up.

Alan07 12-26-2010 06:46 PM
It looks like WPS handle was down about 15%

SCUDSBROTHER 12-26-2010 06:48 PM
It's fast, but i don't think it's favoring speed very much. Caracortado wouldn't of gained that much (late in the Malibu.) On speed favoring tracks, you see closers that are hopelessly out of position. They will be way too far back in the middle of the race.

Kasept 12-26-2010 06:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot (Post 736989)
I know today the track was advertised as having a 3-inch cushion, and the track sure seems to be carrying speed from what I've watched. Sorry for daring to have an opinion. Not. There are multiple horses today that have outrun their figures. Maybe it is a timer problem. Or maybe the track is pretty darn firm and fast.
You have no opinion. You have an agenda. You don't know a thing about the track. You are completely wrong about it as speed-favoring and a concrete highway. Period.

Alan07 12-26-2010 07:00 PM
http://www.drf.com/blogs/santa-anita-faster-bid

GPK 12-26-2010 07:01 PM
*popcorn eating emoticon*

Riot 12-26-2010 07:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasept (Post 737004)
You have no opinion. You have an agenda. You don't know a thing about the track. You are completely wrong about it as speed-favoring and a concrete highway. Period.
Excuse me? Bull. You're the one being rude. I have no agenda here, but you sure have one apparently.

Yes, I like synthetics, but I'm excited SA went back to dirt. I'll be happy to take back the "concrete" remark as an overstatement, but yeah, I absolutely do think the track was playing fast and to speed today, especially after the 4th, and if you think my opinion is crap, feel free to bet against it. We'll have to see if they slow it down in the next few days after it's now dried out. You know, by maybe harrowing it a little deeper.

freddymo 12-26-2010 07:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RolloTomasi (Post 736047)
Seems a better fit in the Sir Beaufort (owns two turf stakes victories already).

I don't think the cutback helps him as he seems to be a frontrunning type. Having to lock horns with top class sprinter Smiling Tiger (who has faced his elders with great success in his last 4 starts--all at the top level) and perhaps Alcindor seems like a recipe for another brick wall collision midstretch.
Nice call for a change..Stick to needles

freddymo 12-26-2010 07:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NTamm1215 (Post 736124)
It's going to be interesting to see how Sadler's horses do on dirt right off the bat. He had little success shipping to tracks with dirt in stakes races over the last few years (1-14 in graded stakes, 1-13 in non-graded stakes) but of course, now they're in his backyard.

I'm going to bet against Twirling Candy. He became the ultimate California hype horse and is going to continue to be overbet because of it. Two romping wins against horrible turf horses doesn't make him a Grade I dirt horse, but we'll see.

Sidney's Candy is going to have to be awfully short to lose the Sir Beaufort. Hopefully after he wins people can start talking about how he reminds them of Lure again.
Sadler horse's seem to be fine of dirt...........

Dahoss 12-26-2010 07:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot (Post 737013)
Excuse me? Bull. You're the one being rude. I have no agenda here, but you sure have one apparently.

Yes, I like synthetics, but I'm excited SA went back to dirt. I'll be happy to take back the "concrete" remark as an overstatement, but yeah, I absolutely do think the track was playing fast and to speed today, especially after the 4th, and if you think my opinion is crap, feel free to bet against it. We'll have to see if they slow it down in the next few days after it's now dried out. You know, by maybe harrowing it a little deeper.
In what races specifically do you think speed was carried by the track?

Kasept 12-26-2010 07:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot (Post 737013)
Excuse me? Bull. You're the one being rude. I have no agenda here, but you sure have one apparently.

Yes, I like synthetics, but I'm excited SA went back to dirt. I'll be happy to take back the "concrete" remark as an overstatement, but yeah, I absolutely do think the track was playing fast and to speed today, especially after the 4th, and if you think my opinion is crap, feel free to bet against it.
I'm not being rude. I'm being succinct. Here's the CHARTS. The surface is fast. Every trainer there has said as much for three weeks. That doesn't make it concrete. And the results make it obvious that while fast, it didn't favor speed.

my miss storm cat 12-26-2010 07:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GPK (Post 737006)
*popcorn eating emoticon*
Can you pass that over please?

freddymo 12-26-2010 07:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sightseek (Post 736953)
What a day by Sadler!
Rollo has left the building.....Again..what a buffoon

freddymo 12-26-2010 07:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasept (Post 737021)
I'm not being rude. I'm being succinct. Here's the CHARTS. The surface is fast. Every trainer there has said as much for three weeks. That doesn't make it concrete. And the results make it obvious that while fast, it didn't favor speed.
actually I think whacky jerry brown gets a thumbs up today..After years of telling us that the surfaces in the 70's were shallow today he might get some redemption..

Sightseek 12-26-2010 07:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot (Post 737013)
Excuse me? Bull. You're the one being rude. I have no agenda here, but you sure have one apparently.

Yes, I like synthetics, but I'm excited SA went back to dirt. I'll be happy to take back the "concrete" remark as an overstatement, but yeah, I absolutely do think the track was playing fast and to speed today, especially after the 4th, and if you think my opinion is crap, feel free to bet against it. We'll have to see if they slow it down in the next few days after it's now dried out. You know, by maybe harrowing it a little deeper.
Do you think fast and speed favoring are one in the same?

Riot 12-26-2010 07:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dahoss (Post 737020)
In what races specifically do you think speed was carried by the track?
I'll have to go back and watch the replays, but I thought The Factor (wow, exciting and speedy) was unexpectedly untireable" in the final 16th, I thought Arresting Officer, Smiling Tiger both lasted longer than expected, and Twirling Candy changed leads in the final strides to the wire yet didn't lose position (and broke the Bid's record?). And the final race (only watched it superficially) - didn't they go around from the backstretch home?

Riot 12-26-2010 07:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sightseek (Post 737027)
Do you think fast and speed favoring are one in the same?
No.

Riot 12-26-2010 07:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasept (Post 737021)
I'm not being rude. I'm being succinct. Here's the CHARTS. The surface is fast. Every trainer there has said as much for three weeks. That doesn't make it concrete. And the results make it obvious that while fast, it didn't favor speed.
Then you ought to be darn happy I bet on horses, so you can take my money.

RockHardTen1985 12-26-2010 07:47 PM
What a giant effort out of Twirling Candy. Im not sure Sidney and Twirling wont stretch out either. Its different going 9f or 10f on dirt then it was on the old ****. Those 2 are STRONG.

Dahoss 12-26-2010 08:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot (Post 737028)
I'll have to go back and watch the replays, but I thought The Factor (wow, exciting and speedy) was unexpectedly untireable" in the final 16th, I thought Arresting Officer, Smiling Tiger both lasted longer than expected, and Twirling Candy changed leads in the final strides to the wire yet didn't lose position (and broke the Bid's record?). And the final race (only watched it superficially) - didn't they go around from the backstretch home?
Longer than you expected? That doesn't make a track speed favoring. When I think of a track as speed favoring, I think of it being very difficult for horses to make up ground on the horses in front. I didn't see that at all today.

Riot 12-26-2010 08:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dahoss (Post 737037)
Longer than you expected? That doesn't make a track speed favoring. When I think of a track as speed favoring, I think of it being very difficult for horses to make up ground on the horses in front. I didn't see that at all today.
Then, you, too, are free to bet against my terribly uneducated opinion. Or semantics. My opinion is the firmer the track, the faster the track, the less tiring the track, the more effortlessly the fastest horses hold their speed (while tiring) while closers have a more difficult time gaining round on them (all exhausted horses of dissimilar running style are not equal in the final two furlongs on a very firm track) ;)

And if you find out what my "agenda" is, let me know

Dahoss 12-26-2010 08:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot (Post 737039)
Then, you, too, are free to bet against my terribly uneducated opinion. Or semantics. My opinion is the firmer the track, the faster the track, the less tiring the track, the more effortlessly the fastest horses hold their speed (while tiring) while closers have a more difficult time gaining round on them (all exhausted horses of dissimilar running style are not equal in the final two furlongs on a very firm track) ;)

And if you find out what my "agenda" is, let me know
It's not semantics. The results of today do not represent a speed favoring track. A fast track does not necessarily mean a speed favoring track. You seem to be confusing the two.

I think you should go back and watch the races, especially the ones where you think speed was carried.

Riot 12-26-2010 08:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dahoss (Post 737043)
It's not semantics. The results of today do not represent a speed favoring track. A fast track does not necessarily mean a speed favoring track. You seem to be confusing the two.

I think you should go back and watch the races, especially the ones where you think speed was carried.
Do you think the track played equally fairly to all running styles today?

Dahoss 12-26-2010 08:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riot (Post 737045)
Do you think the track played equally fairly to all running styles today?
I have only seen each race twice, but at this point yes. A horse like Thirtyfirststreet couldn't win on a speed favoring track. Horses that were 8th and 9th early in the La Brea ran 2-3 in the race.

Riot 12-26-2010 08:45 PM
Then we disagree on how the track was playing.

We agree in that I also mentioned Thirtyfirststreet as a closer (who did close) but I feel the track changed very quickly into the stakes. Was it like Keeneland dirt? Heck no. We'll see what the figure guys do with it.

I did think the paths seemed to play very fairly inside to out, and it is amazing what great condition the track was in, considering all the rain they've dealt with.


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