they were in reference to you knocking invasor for being an import. and they're both in the top 100 horses in the 20th century. but apparently going by what you post, they aren't real champs either.

What's kind of hard to digest, is whether we recognize it or not, our most veratile horses are usually intact and so subconciously we have them on a ticking clock. He IS a gelding so hopefully he stays sound and we get to see him do all kinds of different things. But it is, I imagine, good to pick a line of thought (with small variations, which they have done) and aim. This year it's the classic. Maybe next year they will concentrate on turf. Stay healthy, Big Boy!

I the real world you are right. If he's good to go in the Breeders Cup he has to finish in front of Bernadeni and Invasor to be considered HOY.

I didn't say he isn't a champ. He's just really low on the list of champions. Also I have questions about Doug O'Neill that I will not ask. I'll just let the BC Classic answer them.

Lava Man wont even run in the Breeders Cup, I remember last year when they said that JCGC was their Breeders Cup. This horse cant even beat losers in Japan

And you will take book on this? What odds will you give?

ok, oracle. we're supposed to forgive a bad run by say, st liam when he ships west, but one bad run by a horse going east, well that's never a forgivable sin? is that right? and wasn't that last year? flower alley was a lot of peoples call for hoy this year because of his efforts last year...isn't that enough to say that what happened one year doesn't necessarily translate the next??

I'm not going to delve into semantics with you just to prove a point. Feel free to talk as much smack as you want when Lava Man runs in the Classic.

Zieg forgive? he got beat like 40 lengths last year after this very same race when he came East. He was just awful. Sorry, but beating Good Reward(on dirt no less) really doesnt prove one heck of a lot. Like i said, anyone who wants to make a bet that he wins the East can make it with me, put your money up and lets go.

How about I kill myself if he runs first or second and if he doesn't then you kill yourself?

to be perfectly honest, at THIS point i'm going with invasor. all i'm saying is don't call lava man a bad horse for what he hasn't done this year. all he has done is win. there's no telling what will happen at churchill. i hope they all get there in one piece and run a fair race. let them sort it out. three pages of arguing here doesn't mean squat compared to reality.

I like Zieg and I don't wanna see her die, if she took that bet she would definitely die.
Noone here talking smack will actually have the guts to make a real bet about him winning in the East. Its because they know inside that he came East last year and got absolutely demolished, and that the same thing will happen again this year. None of them will make a real bet on this, they know better.

er, i think he was replying to 2hot there oracle.

OH!! I hope that guy TAKES the bet!! LOL!!!

I'll be on millionnaires row and if he wins the race I promise i'll jump off the ****ing balcony. It'll make the national news.

It just amazes me how people can get excited over an even money horse winning a race. Unless they hit the exotics a few times I fail to see what was so great about the race.

You really don't want me to take you up on that. I have cancer which gives me the real ablity to pay.

all in all Lava Man is a great horse, beating Magnum and Super Frolic day in and day out. Magnum as we all know came was beaten 150 lenghts by INvasor..lol

Oh damn. Lol sorry.

But see, there's a problem with that...

Nobody gives two s hits if you kill yourself, so why gamble something that nobody cares about?

:rolleyes:

Lava Man is a lot better than he was last year. He won't ever win a Grade I on the East Coast because he rarely comes East to race and this year he will be facing a superhorse in the BC Classic. He hasn't just beat Good Reward this year who was obviously cranked for this race. He has also crushed both Seek Gold and Perfect Drift. I really didn't expect the horse to win this race because he had all the excuses in the world. A horse can rarely do what he has done this year even if it was all on the West Coast. Also, most horses wouldn't have won that Hollywood Gold Cup race after all the adversity he faced. His scenerio reminds me a little bit of Seabiscuit's. He had excuses last year as to why he didn't run well on the East Coast and he really is a heck of a lot better horse this year. Don't count Lava Man out when he comes East. I don't think he will win, but he may make some noise.

Mind your tongue, woman.

No need to be sorry, it just goes to show you that my risk might not be as great as yours.

it was like an allowance race written for Lava
or more like the guy hand picked to fight Holyfield last night
but I am impressed with the 6 in a row
in fact, I do like him to win the classic
and win HOY!

Still didn't answer the question...

I think it's ridiculous you'd be willing to bet your own life that a horse finishes off the board in the BC Classic. Unbelievable...

I don't know. The day a claimer wins the Breeders Cup Classic could very well be the day I die. :D

...

I was taking the piss. I am, however, pretty confident this horse will run out of the money at Churchill. Frauds tend to show their true colors on that track.

You went so far as to say he couldn't finish in the money... he could very well hang onto 3rd spot if I do say so myself. Besides, you don't even know the complete field in the Classic. Everyone is on the Bernardini bandwagon, but really, who has he beat? Lava Man proved today that he is capable of beating G1 horses and I would say he's got as good a shot as any at hitting the board in the Classic.

It's really worse than that. Lava Man has raced at Fairplex park which most owners would never race a good horse at for fear of injury on the 5/8 race track. Lava Man had really bad feet when he shipped last year and O'neil is not one of the trainers that does well when he ships. That being said Lava Man has been pointed towards the Breeders cup since he won the Santa Anita Handicap. It's along road.

I think there's no reason to run him in Louisville
Mineshaft, did they run him?
ok Lava isn't the Shaft but...
with all his victories, he may have HOY in the wraps
if he goes to L'ville and busts...? then iffy
of course if he goes to CD and wins
he's a legend

Now why would O Neill not do well when he ships? It doesnt affect most trainers.

That's what everyone thought about The Tin Man.

The only horse back East that might be able to beat Lava Man is Bernardini.

You guys are forgetting that Borrego, who is not nearly as good as LM, went back East and won by 6 lengths.

Who has Lava Man beat? Perfect Hanger? Seek Gold? Seek Gold's win was the fluke of the century.

he doesn't HOY in wraps. he hasn't beaten anyone of consequence yet this year. If people wanna point to Perfect Drift as who he has beaten this year, well, I mean that pretty much says it all

He will ship alittle. I remember Steviewonder Boy!

2 months ago it was Flower Alley and now it's Bernadeni and Invasor. If they all make it to the Breeders Cup Classic I say all Lava Man has to do is finish in the money ahead of those two, but they would have to win the classic to move ahead of LAVA MAN for HOY.

I totally agree with you as you would have gathered if you read my posts. Lava Man had some real excuses and has dramatically improved from last year.

He went head and head in :46 3/5. It's not easy to do that in a 1 1/4 mile race. He finished up pretty good. He ran the 1 1/4 miles in 2:01 3/5. Are you sure that's the slowest ever? The race has only been around for about 12-13 years, but that would still be surprising if 2:01 3/5 is the slowest in 12 years.

By the way, LM has beaten a lot more good horses than Invasor has. He beat Borrego by 8 in the Hollywood Gold Cup last year and earned a 120 Beyer. Borrego went back East a few months later and crushed everyone.

Lava Man!
 

Hey Folks, Theres A New Monster In Town...lava Man. He Can Run With The Best Of Them And He Will Make An Impact With His Kick At Bc Day For Sure.

I don't know if he has improved from last year. I think the two best dirt races he has ever run were both last year. I was most visually impressed with his wins in the Californian and the Hollywood Gold Cup last year. I'm not big on figures but I belive that all the speed figures have those two wins as huge races. I know the Beyers on those two races were 116 and 120. I'm sure the sheet numbers on those races wee really high.

Well, he did put up those two big numbers last year, but he is much more consistent this year. I think the most impressive of LM's races was this year's Hollywood Gold Cup. He really showed what the heart of a true champion and a great racehorse is all about with all the adversity he faced in that race. I really like it when a horse guts out a win like that. It's those kinds of races that show what a horse is really made of, and a horse's heart will carry him when his body has given out. Lava Man is all heart. I think he has really pulled it together this year.