Yes ... they most certainly do.

Their "leaders" have been suppressing their freedom and stealing their meagre resources for centuries. I hope some day the decent folk among the Palestinians are able to unburden themselves from these murderers and thieves ... and able to enjoy the life and liberty that all humans deserve.

Irish,
Thanks for the article. Worth reading for all that have their take on "patriotism".
As our nation celebrates her 230th, it remains that she becomes what she was inspired to become. The path was charted, the destination not yet realized.
Those that seek to quiet voices of patriots deny any and all possibilities, as they calmly wrap themselves in a flag that they hold so dear, and forget the words of freedom that it represents.
Happy 4th!
dTS

I'm an Arab-American. Here's a couple for you...



1. I have taken about 30 plane flights since 9/11. I have never gone through security without "additional processing.

2. My bookie got busted. Small time guy that about 10 of my friends, including Jews, Christians and even a freaking Bhuddist bet with. I a the smallest bettor of all of us. I am also the only one of the 10 of us to get a knock on my door.

3. My mother's telephone has been bugged and debugged three times.

I'm sure you'll concoct some solid as sh1t draped in (both) flag(s) explanation for this worthy of 30 seconds on Geraldo's or Ollie North's shows.

By the way, you never answered my very very simple question.... Do you believe the Palestinians have any valid grievances? Yes or No?

My advice to pgardn was to rid himself of America-hating leftist associations ... and I'll offer the same advice to you.

When you were a youngster ... your parents undoubtedly warned you about getting mixed up with the wrong crowd. As an adult ... you haven't followed that advice ... you've given your mind over to ultraleftist propagandists ... who also happen to be the world's biggest losers.

For the sake of your own future success and happiness ... you should rid yourself of these losers whose philosophy has been relegated to the garbage can of history.

By the way ... the article you cited is not an "editorial" ... it's an opinion column by the very type of leftist loser you should be shunning. If you want to learn more about history, economics, and politics ... try reading the opinion columns of Thomas Sowell ... whose archives can be found at townhall.com.

Good luck.

I answered your question on this thread at 12:42pm.

Take a look.

Bold Brooklynite,
As you go back and read through the ENTIRE thread, realize that I only talked about slavery or historical "facts" that you got wrong and needed correction. It wasn't the British that brought slavery to the Americas.
You have repeatedly taken this thread off topic.
I suggest that you go back to the very beginning of this thread, that I started. Read the article.
ALA means American Library Association (not ACLU).

Pay very careful attention to the words of Thomas Paine, "Ye that dare not only the tyranny but the tyrant, stand forth!"

If you label those words as "pinko" or "leftist", you must have studied at the Spiro Agnew School of Right-Speak. Label the opposition all you want.
Make up names, but somehow, no matter how loudly you yell, your words do not gain veracity with their volume.

Have a nice 4th. Freedom for ALL!

DTS

Sorry, BB. My parents are the losers of whom you speak. You know what I like about them? They would never, EVER refer to another person that way, no matter the color of their political stripes.

I'm quite happy with my life now. I'm glad I can see the good and the bad in my country. Sure, most of my friends are liberals (I'm guessing most of yours are conservatives, and that's fine - like attracts like for all of us), but I do have good friends who are conservatives, and sometimes they help me appreciate issues in a way I wouldn't have seen before. Sometimes, they don't. I think I do the same for them, and I prefer engaging in that kind of conversation than in the name-calling you've resorted to. Do you really think anyone follows your advice when you use such condescension?

Oh, and I used to write opinion pieces for my city paper. Sorry about the mixup in terminology.

The he11 you did.

Again, do think the Palestinians have any valid grievances? Yes or no?

S2S: my answer is Yes.

Sorry about everything your family's been through. I know an apology means nada, but it just sucks.

Happy 4th, DTS!

And also to you, Irish!
Happy 4th...LET FREEDOM RING!!! LET FREEDOM RING!!!

S2S,
Sad that you and yours have been singled out.
If you read the following article, you might see that "freedom" has different meanings to different people.
Don't expect honest answers from those that attach a different meaning.
Labels and insults, yes. Truth...unfortunately, no.
Their "freedom" allows theirs as much as it does ours.

http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0704-29.htm

DTS

Nice try ... but it was you who brought up the subject of slavery ... and ...

... and I never said that the British brought slavery to the Americas ... I said that the United States inherited slavery from the British colonialists ... since all 13 colonies were under British control at the time we declared our independence.

I really hope you'll follow my advice and spend some time reading Thomas Sowell. All of his opinion columns are archived at townhall.com. Pick any ten at random and read them through.

Your horizon will be expanded ... and your mind will be opened to a different way of viewing the world ... and you'll be on your way to a more satisfying life. You may then want to read a few of the dozens of books he has written.

And while you're at townhall.com ... read a few of their other dozens of columnists. You'll be enlightened and inspired ... and you'll never fall sway to leftist agitprop again.

Good luck ... and happy 4th.

That's the very question I answered.

You may not like the answer ... but there you have it.

You'll be a much happier person if you stop wallowing in self-pity ... and stop attributing your misfortunes to others.

No one has ever rolled out the red carpet for any immigrants who have come to this country ... including my grandparents ... nor should they have. It's up to you to make a satisfying life for yourself and the ones you love ... make the most of it ... because there never has been a better time or place to do so than in the United States in 2006.

Good luck ... and happy 4th.

I will certainly go to Townhall.com as per your advice.
I'm always looking to expand and understand. My mind remains open to differing views.
Have a great 4th.

May I ask, where did I make mention of slavery? I thought I was talking about librarians.

Yeah, right. Quite an response.

You're a coward and a fool and a shame to your people.

My life is well made as is that of my family.

You just spout off that right -wing trash.

Next question....What will happen now with Arafat gone? No longer does the myth of "No Partner For Peace" exist.

Who will be Israel's deKlerk? Who will be the Palestinian's Mandela?

You seem to think people are weak and wallow in self-pty. You're a ****ing fool as well as a coward. Take that bull**** flag off your shoulders and get an original thought. Or at least, God willing, allow your children to think more freely than you.

Anyone disagrees with you, you label them as a hater of the Jewish people. Sad. Do not allow your children to grow up as you.

Me LEFT? Holy mackerel... First time I have been accused of that. Ever.

I will again ask you, right here, right now:
IF YOU COULD BE ANY SEX AND ETHNIC GROUP IN THE UNITED STATES WHAT WOULD IT BE?

and the answer is .... male and caucasian.
If this is not the answer, what is the answer?

Female and of Asian descent..... uhmmm maybe Chinese? Dont make me laugh.
Kid yourself all you want. If you want the best chance of "succeeding" in this country, all other things being equal, its white male.

Oh yes. I do consider myself very successful. I have led the American dream thus far. However, my definition of success probably does not run parallel to yours Bold one.

You are correct ... it was Somerfrost who first mentioned slavery ... but ...

... I've been taking on six other posters at once ... not that I mind ... I can handle the whole forum membership without blowing out a match ... so pardon me if I got some names and posts mixed up.

By the way ... I checked townhall.com and they've completely revamped their website. I wasn't able to access individual columnists ... but hopefully this is a temporary condition while they update their site.

You'll love Tom Sowell ... I guarantee it ... if you ever get to read him.

What you say isn't correct ... far from it ... and it's also very condescending ... I seriously doubt that many males or females of African, Asian, or Native American descent would want to switch to whiteys if they were given the choice of doing so.

And even if it were true that white males somehow have an advantage ... let's hypothesize that it is ... so? So what? What profound conclusion are we supposed to draw from it?

P.S. I didn't say you were a leftist ... I just advised you not to intellectually associate with or be swayed by them.

You're the only person on this thread who has resorted to personal insults and cursing against another member of this forum.

Everyone else has argued their positions like intelligent and respectful adults ... why can't you?

If you seriously do not believe this is correct, I cant help you.

Conclusion... are you kidding me?
Conclusion: In this country, at this time, it is an advantage to be white and male. I'll go further. White, male and Christian. And its very clear why this is so. In fact I bet you can answer it yourself. (hint)Who wrote the Constitution? Another hint. They were not black Hindu females.

Our frikkin country was and still is largely run by white, male Christians. If it is not so, TELL ME WHAT ETHNIC GROUP WOULD YOU MOST WANT TO BE IN ORDER TO REALIZE THE FULL BENEFITS OF THIS COUNTRY?

Lets see here. Lets go thru a minor political office, the Presidency... uhmmm I count how many black females... I count how many white males. GET IT?

Other posters help me with this. Is this Repent pulling my chain?

Pgardn, do you think that people who are not white-male-christians are all sitting around the US lamenting their sad lot in life, saying to themselves "Oh how great it would be if I were born a white man". It's condescending if you ask me.

Also I think the advantage now goes to the educated and the hard working. A degreed black female that is ambitious has advantages over a standard white male slacker type that has no ambition.

If that's true, and I say if because i usually skim through threads once you begin to pontificate..... IF it's true it's because you did your usual thing.....

You PUSH and PUSH and PUSH till people have had their limit and you turn around smirking, asking for whichever "offensive" person to be banned.

I like this forum..... I admit, i had ulterior motives for signing on in the first place but i like the people here. No need to dig up your very disturbing past - reasons why you've been banned from other forums. i WILL say that I will ALWAYS resent you for doing the same thing you're doing now to a friend of mine SIMPLY BECAUSE HE WAS FROM TURKEY. You did it to a friend from Ireland too.....

Bold Brooklynite..... the epotime of TUA. You know what that stands for so no need to write it out.

People who don't know you come to your defense for your absurd Mayan King threads..... "well, at least he's making a prediction". they don't realize that all started as a joke but whatever. That doesn't matter.

What DOES is seeing you begin this cycle of hatred with your under-handed jabs and the way you sadistically provoke others till you get the response you want, and all so YOU can play victim.

You're like an accident on the side of the road..... i don't want to look and i know i should put you on ignore, but i just can't help it.

You keep right on pontificating and I'm sure Dixie will come to your aid. Congratulations..... you've found your victim in Sent to Stud for obvious reasons. The thing is though, some of us will be right here for him / her even if we don't know or have never "talked" to him / her because we KNOW what you're about.

I apologize to the administrator of this forum..... if I get banned for getting personal it's your call. If my post deserves to be deleted it's your call. i can't keep quiet when I see this **** starting up again though.

- SUNDAY

Jim, you're 100% correct.

The United States is a meritocracy ... no one "runs" it ... and anyone who has the wisdom and fortitude to create wealth can be enormously successful. Americans don't care if the person who designed and built their office chair was male or female, European or African or Asian. They just want the chair to be comfortable and affordable.

Opportunity for success exists in abundance for all ... unfortunately so does opportunity to whine and moan about how successful other people are.

Here is how I see it. All other things being equal, hardworking, intelligent, etc... the probability of experiencing the max. benefits in this country would go to... white males. I will add this is MUCH less a factor than it used to be. But it is still true. If it is not, give me the ethnicity and sex of a person, all other things being equal, that has a better chance. I have put out this challenge, and no hermaphrodites of Haitan descent have come forward and claimed that they have a clear advantage of experiencing the max. benefits this country has to give.

Take a gander at corporate America, Political offices, etc... places of what many would consider power.

Really everyone ask themselves why everyone of our presidents has been white and male, and most professed Christians. Its not numbers, there are just as many females as males...

I see this as profoundly obvious, no matter how distasteful it is.

And Bold One I really mean PROFOUNDLY OBVIOUS.

Hey lets do horses... The people who really run the industry. Owners, trainers, and breeders. I guess they are mostly females of Pacific Island descent.

What most people dont like is not what I have stated; Its what the implications of this very obvious observation means. And to this I have made one comment. It has lead to devisivness that has led to some really unfair situations in other areas.

The example I gave then said that White kids now get the shaft when being accepted to colleges. I have seen over and over again first hand.

And the Bold one then cautioned me in his sage way about not falling into the leftist camp. Oh Boy....If I am on the left, there is a large vacuous right.

Sorry if I call em like I see em. Its the pattern recognition thing that often comes when one is trained in a particular area that requires it. I make broad generalizations. And in this case, I am pretty sure I have a clear pattern looking at the History and the present day of our country.

You keep saying the same thing over and over again ... but you still haven't told us what your point is.

You seem obsessed by race and ethnicity and who has "power" and who has the "benefits" ... but you never tell us what they are and why they're important ... and what's so insufferable about life in the United States for people who aren't "white" males ... and where life would be better for them.

You mention the minor sport of thoroughbred racing as being a "white" stronghold ... but you don't mention the three major sports of baseball, football, or basketball.

Please ... please ... tell us what profound point you're trying to make.

Yes, so far the presidents have all been white and male. That will change in the next twenty years or so, in my opinion we'll see a women and possibly a black or hispanic president. Where is the big conspiracy with regard to keeping the president white? How does it work? I thought the president was elected by all the people, all races and genders. Since there are more women then men, why don't they just elect a women for president? There are a lot of women and minorities out there pulling the lever in the voting booth for white males.

Question: what are the maximum benefits that you refer to that this country offers? I didn't know that there are different benefit packages. I'm a white male and I think I may have missed the line where they were handing out these maximium benefits that others don't get.

Where in any post did I mention the insufferable life in the US? WHERE? You my friend took my observation and placed what YOU thought was a point I was trying to make. The only manifestation of my observation mentioned was the reverse discrimination example I gave.

JEEEEEEEZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ. There is no other point for God sakes. It is a terribly obvious OBSERVATION. Do you refute it? Or what? What is your point? Does Gravity have a point? Does the speed of light have a point? Does pi have a point. NO. It just is.


And what a horrible example with the sports... Who are the OWNERS of the big 3 sports? Do you actually think the employees make more money than the owners? Is this what you are implying?

You are digging yourself a terribly large hole with your agenda.

OK ... at last ... I finally get it ...

... your posts are like the Seinfeld show ... they're about nothing.

That's fine with me ... no problem whatsoever ... I can dig it.

Gotta say nighty-nite now ... hang in there, good buddy.

Since I do not know what you do Arljim I will explain what I do. I now teach Physics. I use to work in a Molecular Biology lab. I have done a little computer programming on the side for people in business when personal computers were first getting started and was offered numerous jobs. If I had been born black instead of white I am sure I would have not had the same offers in any of these adventures. Positive. And there is much more, but it is all ancedotal.
So all the opportunities that have come your way... it would not make a difference what color or sex you are?

Actually maybe they were but they revealed a heck of a lot about you. You dont answer questions posed to you. You misrepresent what I have posted and what others have posted. And that you are a little quick with your assumptions. Careful. There are some people that will call you out when you step too far.

So in conclusion: In this country, white males have had and still have (albeit not as great as in the past) a greater PROBABILITY of experiencing the full benefits our society has to offer compared the opposite sex and other ethnic groups. I made a provacative observation that you dont like but cannot refute.
I would say nighty nite also if I got boxed in.

So your teaching position was just handed to you when there were equally qualified people of color and women applying for the same position?
In my case I know I definitely earned my pay and position. I don't know why a person of color couldn't have done the same.

I have a technical position in the private sector. I have not witnessed the type of discrimination that you claim is the norm across the country. The people that cut it work hard, have good attitudes, and have skills.

Now its gonna get interesting. This could lead down a path where the answers will vary widely. We might get down to the Why. And this will illustrate some very different views.

There were no applicants of other ethnic groups for Science positions. None. Zero. In fact, sitting in on interviews with applicants for science positions for about 12 years now, the vast majority of these applicants are clearly white and male. Females on the rise however.
I have seen zero black applicants. I have never been on a faculty with a black science teacher. The approximate racial breadown of the students in these schools would be 40% Hispanic, 40% White, 20% Black. The school I teach at presently (a burb school) would go about 55% White, 35% Hispanic, 10% Black. The Schools I have taught at average about 3000 students. The current school well over 3000 students.

Interesting pattern. In fact in all my upper division and graduate level science courses (these were small classes at a very large institution, University of Texas) there were zero black students... I get the Newsletter from the school of Natural Sciences at UT. They give you an update on the diff. graduate students and professors and what they are researching. Zero black students. Zero black professors. More females than my day. My GUESS is there are no black applicants for faculity or graduate students.

Why the obvious discrepancy in numbers? Black people hate science?

OK ... after a refreshing night's sleep ... let's get back on the job ...

You state that I don't answer questions posed to me ... but you provide no examples. Please cite the questions ... and I will answer them.

You state that I misrepresent what you and others posted ... but you provide no examples. Please cite the alleged misrepresentations ... and I will address them.

You state ... over and over again ... that white males have a greater probability of experiencing the full benefits of society ... yet after dozens of posts and many imprecations from others ... you still haven't stated what those benefits are ... nor have you provided any data to support your basic premise. Once again ... please tell us what these "benefits" are ... and please provide some support for your premise. (And please don't provide personal anecdotes ... because there's no way anyone else can verify or dispute them.)

Hope you had a good rest too.

Note to Downthestretch ... and everyone else ...

I checked the townhall.com website this morning ... and it seems to be back running normally ... with a new layout.

If you want to read the writings of Thomas Sowell ... or any of their other columnists ... go to www.townhall.com/columnists.

Just scroll down the alphabetical list ... with photos ... and find the columnist of your choice. Click on the "archive" button ... and all of that writer's columns will pop up.

Enjoy.

Thomas Sowell, lol. Another ****ing idiot of your ilk. You are a fool and coward. Please do not breed.

More cursing and personal attacks ... is that all you can add to the discussion?

It's not a discussion. It's just you and your far Right wing z*****t psychbabbling and hiding behind the "well, you just hate J*** " as a snappy (yet so very unhighly unoriginal) retort for those who disagree with your foolish and cowardly remarks.

I asked you a oouple reasonable questions. You of course cower, hide behind the writings of Sowell and others and toss back insultive remarks as the fool you obviously are.

I lament for you and, especially, for your children who are subject to your obvious hate for those who do not share your heritage.

Shame on you.

Well, f*** you too pal.

Townhall.com.... go visit. You'll find one of the top headings to be ... "How To Buy A Handgun."

Yes, that's great. Good to be helping psychobabbling icowardly diots like you and BB do the important, forward-thinking work that, obviously, must be done.