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-   -   Street Sense to skip Belmont (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13748)

Buffymommy 05-31-2007 09:51 AM

I guess they are thinking of their horse first. I know the fans are going to be disappointed and angry, but it is their horse.

Besides, they are probably afraid of Tizzy! :)

SuffolkGirl 05-31-2007 09:51 AM

While I was looking forward to Curlin, Street Sense and Hard Spun to contest the Belmont I trust they have made the right decision for the horse. I look forward to seeing SS run later this year.

hockey2315 05-31-2007 10:05 AM

What a joke. . . The first triple crown race I'll ever see in person just got a lot less interesting. . .

justindew 05-31-2007 10:07 AM

Louis Quatorze ran in all three legs of the Triple Crown, then won the Jim Dandy and almost won the Travers before missing by a nose in the Breeders' Cup Classic.

It's a sad day when a Kentucky Derby winner, who is training well, can't be expected to keep the same schedule as Louis Quatorze.

Coach Pants 05-31-2007 10:14 AM

Looks like Nafzger didn't want to make the same mistake twice (Unbridled)

Good for him.

Cajungator26 05-31-2007 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by justindew
Louis Quatorze ran in all three legs of the Triple Crown, then won the Jim Dandy and almost won the Travers before missing by a nose in the Breeders' Cup Classic.

It's a sad day when a Kentucky Derby winner, who is training well, can't be expected to keep the same schedule as Louis Quatorze.

Two different horses. I would hope that Nafzger knows what is best for his horses.

King Glorious 05-31-2007 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by justindew
Louis Quatorze ran in all three legs of the Triple Crown, then won the Jim Dandy and almost won the Travers before missing by a nose in the Breeders' Cup Classic.

It's a sad day when a Kentucky Derby winner, who is training well, can't be expected to keep the same schedule as Louis Quatorze.

That was back in 1996. That seems like an eternity. The game has changed drastically in the past 10 years. Since then, u've had Medaglia d'Oro run in all three, win the two Saratoga races and run in the BC. We've had War Emblem and Funny Cide run in all three and run in the BC. Anymore or is that it?

tycharles01 05-31-2007 10:22 AM

So who might be pointed to the Belmont since SS is out??


Rags?
Sedgefield??

justindew 05-31-2007 10:23 AM

I'm not even holding Street Sense to the same standard as Medaglia D' Oro. And I didn't use War Emblem or Funny Cide in my argument becasue they did nothing in the BC Classic. I used Louis Quatorze because he darn near won the BC Classic and the Travers, and becuase he isn't exactly regarded as one of the top 25 horses in the last 10 years or so. Although I really liked him.

philcski 05-31-2007 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tycharles01
So who might be pointed to the Belmont since SS is out??


Rags?
Sedgefield??

Rags- likely not running, as per Pletcher
Sedgefield- injured, out for about 6 months

philcski 05-31-2007 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pillow Pants
Looks like Nafzger didn't want to make the same mistake twice (Unbridled)

Good for him.

Pillow- Unbridled was a notorious bleeder and in '90 you couldn't run on Lasix in NY, and apparently he bled badly in the Belmont June heat. Not saying it's the wrong decision to hold him out if he doesn't think he's ready to roll but I don't think his Unbridled experience had much to do with it.

lemoncrush 05-31-2007 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tycharles01
So who might be pointed to the Belmont since SS is out??


Rags?
Sedgefield??

I'd like to see both of these go to make it more interesting.

And I'm not pissed about Street Sense skipping it.
I'd much rather see the Kentucky Derby winner run in the Breeders Cup Classic (going the same distance he won the derby), than running him back in the Belmont going 12F. There's no triple crown on the line and there's a real possibility he wouldn't be back to race in the fall.

slotdirt 05-31-2007 10:36 AM

I'd rather see the Derby winner in the Belmont - a far more historically significant race - than the Breeders Cup.

hockey2315 05-31-2007 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slotdirt
I'd rather see the Derby winner in the Belmont - a far more historically significant race - than the Breeders Cup.

I agree. . . This is where the best three year olds are supposed to run. . . Street Sense has a much better chance to win the Belmont than he does the BC Classic with EEnvAsor so I don't understand why they wouldn't run him. . .

Coach Pants 05-31-2007 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by philcski
Pillow- Unbridled was a notorious bleeder and in '90 you couldn't run on Lasix in NY, and apparently he bled badly in the Belmont June heat. Not saying it's the wrong decision to hold him out if he doesn't think he's ready to roll but I don't think his Unbridled experience had much to do with it.

I'm just going by coincidence. Street Sense and Unbridled have the same record in Triple Crown races. Following that logic, Street Sense's chances weren't great in the Belmont.

Regardless i'm not upset over this decision. Street Sense was trained this year with the Derby as the priority.

If people want these horses to run, maybe an outcry for larger purses should be in order.

slotdirt 05-31-2007 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pillow Pants
If people want these horses to run, maybe an outcry for larger purses should be in order.

Yes, that million dollar purse is just miniscule.

Coach Pants 05-31-2007 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slotdirt
Yes, that million dollar purse is just miniscule.

:rolleyes:

Linny 05-31-2007 11:16 AM

I'm disappointed but not shocked. I find it sad that the $1m G1 Belmont stakes doesn't have enough cache on it's own to attract the Derby winner/Preakness runner up in an attempt to even the score.

whodey17 05-31-2007 11:21 AM

I dont have a problem with this move at all. I don't think Carl looks at the Belmont the same way as he does the Travers. There is no need to run SS in the Belmont. A nice 2 month layoff and then the Dandy or Haskell and then they Travers. Then onto to the Breeders Cup if all goes well. If this plan works, SS would have raced 7 times in 2007. Not really much more you can ask in this day of racing.

Kasept 05-31-2007 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slotdirt
Yes, that million dollar purse is just miniscule.

John,

I tend to agree that the purses could use a tweak as incentive.. or at least the resurrection of the TC bonus.. And the Derby at $2MM is STILL less than it should be given its' status..

NTamm1215 05-31-2007 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whodey17
I dont have a problem with this move at all. I don't think Carl looks at the Belmont the same way as he does the Travers. There is no need to run SS in the Belmont. A nice 2 month layoff and then the Dandy or Haskell and then they Travers. Then onto to the Breeders Cup if all goes well. If this plan works, SS would have raced 7 times in 2007. Not really much more you can ask in this day of racing.

I hope Nafzger doesn't think he can go Haskell or Jim Dandy-Travers-BC Classic. Making your first start against elders in the Classic has not been a terrific move.

NT

Cajungator26 05-31-2007 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NTamm1215
I hope Nafzger doesn't think he can go Haskell or Jim Dandy-Travers-BC Classic. Making your first start against elders in the Classic has not been a terrific move.

NT

Perhaps not, but Flower Alley managed to finish 2nd. IMO, Street Sense is a much better horse than FA was.

ARyan 05-31-2007 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cajungator26
Perhaps not, but Flower Alley managed to finish 2nd. IMO, Street Sense is a much better horse than FA was.


I would guess they would give SS one more prep before the Classic.

philcski 05-31-2007 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cajungator26
Perhaps not, but Flower Alley managed to finish 2nd. IMO, Street Sense is a much better horse than FA was.

FA did start in the JCGC and finished a distant 4th, and you may recall Pletcher sending out Bishop Court Hill as a rabbit and Chantal Sutherland totally botching the assignment.

SS is a MUCH better horse than FA, that I can agree with you on.

Coach Pants 05-31-2007 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kasept
John,

I tend to agree that the purses could use a tweak as incentive.. or at least the resurrection of the TC bonus.. And the Derby at $2MM is STILL less than it should be given its' status..

Exactly. It's a travesty that the Belmont Stakes has the same purse as the Travers and Haskell Invitational.

I'm still baffled how no company has stepped up and replaced Visa for the Triple Crown bonus. At the very least I expected J. Paul Reddam's Cash Call to step up to the plate.

justindew 05-31-2007 12:10 PM

Bottom Line: This is another in a long line of disappointing moments for this sport.

ARyan 05-31-2007 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by justindew
Bottom Line: This is another in a long line of disappointing moments for this sport.

I think that statement over this is extremly overdramatic.

justindew 05-31-2007 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ARyan
I think that statement over this is extremly overdramatic.

Really? Why?

slotdirt 05-31-2007 12:19 PM

I do agree with justin in that in order to build horse racing's following, we need to have our biggest stars run in the biggest races. The Belmont is for American dirt racing one of the three most well-known and followed races, and it would have been a nice moment to see Street Sense and Curlin butt heads again here.

ARyan 05-31-2007 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by justindew
Really? Why?

You think this is one of the most pressing issues in the sport? The fact that an owner and trainer are looking to skip 1 race to be prepared for a long summer and fall campaign.

You don't think the doping and drugs are a bigger and more disappointing issue? Do you think this whole New York Racing issue is going rather well? How about that almost every decent 3 year old colt gets retired to the shed and we never get to see a 4 year old campaign. That isn't disappointing?

While its too bad we won't get to see these 3 horses run against each other in the Belmont, will you be complainging if they run in the Travers, or the BC Classic? Or would rather see them all retired or injured and we get to see Circular Quay run against Invasor in the Classic?

Instead of ridiculing or being pissed about the situation, try to find some good aspects to look at. Who knows, maybe we might get a 4 year old season from Street Sense, and then who will be complaining that he skipped the Belmont?

justindew 05-31-2007 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ARyan
You think this is one of the most pressing issues in the sport? The fact that an owner and trainer are looking to skip 1 race to be prepared for a long summer and fall campaign.

You don't think the doping and drugs are a bigger and more disappointing issue? Do you think this whole New York Racing issue is going rather well? How about that almost every decent 3 year old colt gets retired to the shed and we never get to see a 4 year old campaign. That isn't disappointing?

While its too bad we won't get to see these 3 horses run against each other in the Belmont, will you be complainging if they run in the Travers, or the BC Classic? Or would rather see them all retired or injured and we get to see Circular Quay run against Invasor in the Classic?

With all due respect, what are you talking about? I never said anything about drugs or early retirement. I said this one issue is a disappointment, and there have been many before it. Yes, of course there are other issues that need to be addressed. Yes, there are bigger problems. That doesn't mean this isn't also disappointing.

Buffymommy 05-31-2007 12:28 PM

I think more horses will enter now.

ARyan 05-31-2007 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by justindew
With all due respect, what are you talking about? I never said anything about drugs or early retirement. I said this one issue is a disappointment, and there have been many before it. Yes, of course there are other issues that need to be addressed. Yes, there are bigger problems. That doesn't mean this isn't also disappointing.

You said; "Bottom Line: This is another in a long line of disappointing moments for this sport." I just don't think this falls into that. I think there are many aspects of this game, some of which I noted, that are far more disappointing than SS skipping the Belmont to shoot for the Travers then BC Classic.

We can agree to disagree, but I still think this is overkill for a horse and trainer who wish to shoot for a long term goal with their colt.

I am just amazed that this much is being made over this. It would be one thing if they were retiring Street Sense, or picking a different race the same weekend of the Belmont, but I don't think this will destroy the racing fan base or hinder new fans.

Just my take.

wiphan 05-31-2007 12:50 PM

Street Sense
 
It is understandable that people are frustrated that SS is not in the Belmont, but his connections are doing what is best for him; not the fans. A trainers job is to do right by the horse and find the best spots for there horse to win. These 3 races are very tiring on a still growing 3 yr old horse. SS gave 2 great races and they don't feel he can do a 3rd within the 5 wk period. I think it is commendable that his connections aren't chasing the $ and doing what is best for the future of their colt. At least he gave you 2 great races. Bernardini only raced once and then was retired shortly after that. Be thankful that SS will be pointed to some great races later on like the Travers, etc.

boswd 05-31-2007 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cardus
Bloodhorse's report, full of Nafzger's quotes:

http://tcm.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=39154


You can defintily tell these guys are very old school. Though the Travers is still a very highly regarding race and the next big race in terms of Prestige behind the Triple Crown but these guys have been around this game for a long time and back when The Travers was just as big as the other ones. Though it's sad to not have SS run in the Belmont it is sort of refreshing in way for Nafger to hold the Travers in such high esteem that way it was once thought of and should still be.
You see so many other trainers who after the TC races and will race top quality hoses in those cheesy, " Hey we'll throw a million $ race" ( Penn. Derby etc) and skip the Travers.
Again though I wish he was running in The Belmont, I love his old school way of thinking in regards to The Travers.

todko 05-31-2007 01:01 PM

I think Nafzger and connections saw all they needed to see when Curlin came back and won. It's foolish to run against that horse again.

justindew 05-31-2007 01:06 PM

I think the REALLY sad thing is that modern horses aren't tough enough to run in all thre Triple Crown races, take two months off, and then begin a new campaign. By skipping the Belmont, Nafzger is essentially saying, "My horse can't run in the Belmont and still be compeititve two and a half months later in the Travers." That's what is sad.


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