Does anyone know how many 2&3 year olds TAP gets a year? I would assume 200+ combined? Would any of them not be considered 75k+ specimen's in advance of the start of their pending career? Would be OK with me if they split award for trainers with 100 or more being one category and 100 or less another.

Personally I think a trainers success isn't just winning A race and then the horse goes into hibernation or abyss. Plus why not give credit to trainers who's stock stays at levels(Brown) and improves(Motion) vs. just winning a big race and never circling back or healthy enough to return to winning form. If the answer is its not "Their Program" then I wish to change the channel to more intelligent and healthy programming. That said TAP is a HoF trainer who enjoys immense success and one of the very best at what he does. Trainer of Year...Not for me especially this year

Pretty easy to win the 100 yard dash when one starts on the 75 yard line. He should win the eclipse for best businessman.

Steve, thanks for posting. I've heard you sing the praises of Lady Eli on your show many times. With all due respect, how can you think her body of work is better than Take Charge Brandi's? If the voting was immediately after the BC a solid case could be made for Lady Eli. But adding another G1 and a $1 million G3 makes this a slam dunk case for TCB.

I totally understand your logic for Lady Eli. She was visually impressive and you believe she's the best 2yo filly. But her on-track results do not stack up to TCB and it's really not close.

To put it another way, Dortmund is widely regarded as the best 2yo cold in the country. But what he's done on the track should not earn him the Eclipse. Obviously that's an extreme analogy, but it clarifies my point.

I really do not want to start an argument, just a discussion. Thanks again.

Todd is not in the Hall of Fame.

I realize he has not been elected but nonetheless he will certainly be inducted.

yea they said that about Steve A as well...things do happen, its not a given.

They did?

Eclipse Awards finalists
 

The 2014 Eclipse Awards finalists, in alphabetical order:

Two-Year-Old Male: American Pharoah, Hootenanny, Texas Red
Two-Year-Old Filly: Condo Commando, Lady Eli, Take Charge Brandi

Three-Year-Old Male: Bayern, California Chrome, Shared Belief
Three-Year-Old Filly: Stopchargingmaria, Sweet Reason, Untapable

Older Male: Main Sequence, Palace Malice, Wise Dan
Older Female: Close Hatches, Dayatthespa, Don’t Tell Sophia

Male Sprinter: Goldencents, Private Zone, Work All Week
Female Sprinter: Artemis Agrotera, Judy the Beauty, Sweet Reason

Male Turf Horse: Karakontie (JPN), Main Sequence, Wise Dan
Female Turf Horse: Crown Queen, Dayatthespa, Stephanie’s Kitten
Steeplechase Horse: Demonstrative, Divine Fortune, Makari (GB)

Owner: Kaleem Shah, Midwest Thoroughbreds, Ken and Sarah Ramsey
Breeder: Adena Springs, Ken and Sarah Ramsey, Winchell Thoroughbreds
Trainer: Bob Baffert, Chad Brown, Todd Pletcher

Jockey: Javier Castellano, Joel Rosario, John Velazquez
Apprentice Jockey: Angel Cruz, Taylor Rice, Drayden Van Dyke

Horse of the Year: Bayern, California Chrome, Main Sequence

The 2014 Eclipse Awards finalists, in alphabetical order:

Two-Year-Old Male: American Pharoah
Two-Year-Old Filly: Take Charge Brandi

Three-Year-Old Male: Bayern
Three-Year-Old Filly: Untapable

Older Male: Main Sequence
Older Female: Don’t Tell Sophia

Male Sprinter: Goldencents
Female Sprinter: Judy the Beauty

Male Turf Horse: Main Sequence
Female Turf Horse: Dayatthespa
Steeplechase Horse: Demonstrative

Owner: Ken and Sarah Ramsey
Breeder: Ken and Sarah Ramsey
Trainer: Todd Pletcher

Jockey: Javier Castellano
Apprentice Jockey: Angel Cruz

Horse of the Year: Main Sequence

just my opinion

I don't get him as HOY either, but the way he wins is not what diminishes the consideration. It is turf racing after all.. They're generally not separated by significant margins to start with. The fact that he beat a high quality International cast in the BC Turf in the same fashion as the more modest types he beat the rest of the year, really answers all questions about him stylistically. He was capable of getting to the wire first no matter the depth and quality of the fields he faced.

To me, the 4 very nice G1 turf efforts just don't measure up to what the 3yo boys and even Untapable did in 2014.

That's a good point about Untapable, Steve. She would have been a better candidate.

I love Main Sequence, and am a huge fan of Graham as a trainer, but I would never consider him a legit HOY candidate.

HB,

I know I'm on an island with Lady Eli after Brandi's Starlet. But, while Brandi was obviously the best main track filly, I think the group as a whole was less than even ordinary. Meanwhile, Lady Eli's BC J-Filly Turf topped an International cast with real credentials and was done in extraordinary fashion for a 2yo filly. I think Lady Eli is an exceptional talent and that Take Charge Brandi is simply the best of a bad bunch. By comparison, American Pharoah appears poised to be the 2yo champion off a 3 race campaign while Texas Red and Hootenany both built more fully fleshed out seasons.

On the HOY ballot, I went Bayern, California Chrome, Untapable. It seems to me that Main Sequence's HOY consideration is being advanced simply out of misplaced animus toward Bayern and Baffert.

Just my opinion, undefeated in four grade 1 races, again undefeated in 4 grade 1 races, can anyone else stake that claim? He was Perfection, plain and simple..

If a horse was four for four in claiming races that would be perfection too....at least by your standards.

Unless winning photos over Twilight Eclipse ( twice ) and Imagining ( once ) is your idea of HOY type performances?

Untapable was 4-4 in Grade I races against her own sex.

This idea that Horse of the Year needs to go to undefeated horses has become pervasive and it is just awful in my opinion.

Realistically, it's a silly award that jumped the shark four years ago. A large group of non-betting social media titans seem to choose one horse each year, abandoning reason and projecting their opinion on all others. This year they reject Bayern because A) he had the audacity to lose a few times and B) they accept him as the BCC winner about as much as the Democrats accepted Bush in 2000.

lol, I said Undefeated in 4 GRADE 1 Races,including Breeders Cup Turf!!

PS: my second choise IS BAYERN