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-   -   9/27 (OSA): Goodwood Day (6 Gr. I stakes) (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25232)

RolloTomasi 09-25-2008 04:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by King Glorious
I just don't see running against males as being more difficult than running against females simply because of the fact that they are males. I mentioned Personal Ensign earlier but I always thought she was given way too much credit for beating the boys. It was Gulch and King's Swan at 9f. Facing boys in and of itself is not tough if you are better than them. Proud Spell probably had a tougher race in the Alabama than she would have had she gone in the Jim Dandy or Travers because the horse she faced in Music Spell is better than anything in those two male races, IMO. If you want to talk about a race frying a horse, look no further than that effort and her subsequent run in the Cotillion.
That's fair enough, though I don't necessarily agree that the 3yo colt races were by any means easier.

And just for the record, Gulch was a Grade 1 winner at 9f and classic-placed. Maybe he didn't win all his route races, but he certainly could get the distance.

King Glorious 09-25-2008 04:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RolloTomasi
That's fair enough, though I don't necessarily agree that the 3yo colt races were by any means easier.

And just for the record, Gulch was a Grade 1 winner at 9f and classic-placed. Maybe he didn't win all his route races, but he certainly could get the distance.
I didn't mean to imply that Gulch was a flunky at the distance. He was a very talented horse by all means. I just meant that she wasn't facing a horse that was probably among the top 10 older male route runners that year.

Let's say it wasn't the Dandy or the Travers. Say it was the Super Derby or the WV Derby? I think those would have been easier for her than the Alabama was.

RolloTomasi 09-25-2008 04:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by King Glorious
Let's say it wasn't the Dandy or the Travers. Say it was the Super Derby or the WV Derby? I think those would have been easier for her than the Alabama was.
To be honest, and I mentioned this in the Cotillion thread, Proud Spell IMO makes hard work of it regardless of the field (at least she has since the Mother Goose debacle). I thought she looked like hammered sh!t entering the far turn of the Delaware Oaks, yet she gutted out the win. I think the main thing with the Alabama was the 10f distance being to much for her. She is very similar to Ginger Punch in these respects.

Also, I'm not sold that Music Note, who's 3 Grade 1 wins are all basically gimme's, is necessarily tougher than the second tier 3yos. I think she should have won the Alabama given the way the race played out.

10 pnt move up 09-25-2008 04:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RolloTomasi
Speaking of that horse, Details R Sketchy, I didn't think he looked nearly as good as he did at Del Mar, although he did show some grit when challenged to pull clear late. Looked like he was under a lot of pressure through the stretch though, and I'd imagine he won't go much further than 6 or 7f (he's by King's Bishop runner-up Great Notion).

The Hollywood Prevue is probably next, but I don't think he's the next Afternoon Deelites.

Watch for a horse that came out of his maiden race. Can't remember the name, but its a Distorted Humor owned by George Strawbridge and trained by Neil Drysdale. Was a good 12 lengths off the leader early and was the only horse from the back markers to rally, coming on in the far turn to be a decent 4th about 5 back.
he is "ok", GG never throws down early so when you have those slow-fast finishes with him riding on the lead its tough to gage. He aint much and if he was he would have run saturday rather then today.

hrfan 09-25-2008 10:46 PM
i think street boss is pretty close to a lock, as well as Red Giant, i think wait a while is going to get beat.

hrfan 09-25-2008 10:47 PM
maybe tiago finally puts it together, off of a little layoff ?

letswastemoney 09-26-2008 12:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hrfan
maybe tiago finally puts it together, off of a little layoff ?
He's been disappointing on synthetics ever since his Goodwood victory last year. Maybe I have just thought too highly of him though.

hockey2315 09-26-2008 12:12 AM
Slew's Tiznow is mildly intriguing. . .

hrfan 09-26-2008 12:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hockey2315
Slew's Tiznow is mildly intriguing. . .
i agree...
hoss, i guess i mean more then a lock then Zenyatta......
Red Giant is going to run huge, and is most likely winner, maybe i should not say a lock

hrfan 09-26-2008 12:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHoss9698
I disagree he's most likely winner also. I think Out of Control and/or Spring House can handle him and maybe even Transduction Gold. I actually think transduction Gold is a little sneaky in here, although it seems like he never wins.
Spring House... i wont say anything about him
Trans Gold never wins, your right !
Out of Control, i think Red Giant is simply better, a better horse, who had a better prep, and will be more ready for this spot.

odbaxter 09-26-2008 07:11 AM
I'm going to bet the farm on Well Armed. He ran a huge Pacific Classic near the front on a track playing to closers. Even if the pace was a little soft there was a clear advantage to the off the pace types at DM.

odbaxter 09-26-2008 07:15 AM
I'm also juiced to see if Spirit One can handle the Pro-ride. Does anyone now if he has trained over synthetic in Europe?

Bobby Fischer 09-26-2008 09:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by odbaxter
I'm going to bet the farm on Well Armed. He ran a huge Pacific Classic near the front on a track playing to closers. Even if the pace was a little soft there was a clear advantage to the off the pace types at DM.
Well Armed has everything his own way on paper. Only Surf Cat has a big chance to wrest the pace early, and Well Armed looks to be stronger.

9 furlongs seems short for a classic division turf stakes at this time of year.

Mast Track is a solid synth/turf horse, who doesn't need the lead.

Is Albertus Maximus juiced enough to justify use in exotics?? Same old goof, or is the trainer move-up the key to :$: in this race?

hockey2315 09-26-2008 10:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by odbaxter
I'm also juiced to see if Spirit One can handle the Pro-ride. Does anyone now if he has trained over synthetic in Europe?
If I remember correctly he had a huge workout on the poly at Arlington before the million. . .

cowgirlintexas 09-26-2008 10:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hockey2315
If I remember correctly he had a huge workout on the poly at Arlington before the million. . .
With the shorter stretch(verses the ones in Europe) they hopefully won't be able to catch him.

odbaxter 09-26-2008 11:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby Fischer
Well Armed has everything his own way on paper. Only Surf Cat has a big chance to wrest the pace early, and Well Armed looks to be stronger.

9 furlongs seems short for a classic division turf stakes at this time of year.

Mast Track is a solid synth/turf horse, who doesn't need the lead.

Is Albertus Maximus juiced enough to justify use in exotics?? Same old goof, or is the trainer move-up the key to :$: in this race?
I don't like him in this spot. I think he is in way over his head. He may squeak into the tri or super which would help bring some :$: but.....

Bobby Fischer 09-26-2008 12:05 PM
Spirit One is interesting.

I don't think he gets the lead any time before 6furlongs, and it will take either a closing kick or an extremely tough performance to contest for the win.

Expecting Mendizable? to ride agressively pressing the pace.

GBBob 09-26-2008 12:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby Fischer
Spirit One is interesting.

I don't think he gets the lead any time before 6furlongs, and it will take either a closing kick or an extremely tough performance to contest for the win.

Expecting Mendizable? to ride agressively pressing the pace.
I think Spirit One could have been caught by Archipenko in the Million even as lone speed if he hadn't been pinned in the stretch


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