I don't remember the race well enough to describe it that way but it was the day Wagon Limit won.

Yes. Chuck and I were talking about that the other day, it was one of the last big races where he was an assistant to Jerkens.

This thread just goes to show how much of a crapshoot the breeding side of the business can be. The horses mentioned (or referenced) include Formal Gold, Skip Away, Louis Quatorze, Will's Way, Gentlemen, Silver Charm, Captain Bodgit, Free House, Behrens, Black Tie Affair and Touch Gold - all serious racehorses. Of all these, probably only Touch Gold could be considered a success at stud.

You're right. According to his page on the farm in LA where he stands, Rodeo ran a 104 Beyer in his debut, which they claim was the fastest of any 2YO that year.

I don't know, Louis Quatorze has had a couple of nice runners, and Black Tie Affair, of course, is the sire of Formal Gold. Free House, well, he died, so I'm not going to hold that against him. Silver Charm wasn't exactly given a chance domestically; we'll see how he works out in Japan.

I realize that some have had a few nice horses, but with the exception of Touch Gold and Skip Away, these horses have been relegated to serving regional markets. Consider how they have done versus some of the other horses that entered stud in either 1998 or 1999 (many of which had far less distinguished racing careers and started at very modest stud fees in comparison): Arch, Benchmark, Distorted Humor, Elusive Quality, Grand Slam, Indian Charlie, Langfuhr, Northern Afleet, Pulpit, Smoke Glacken, Stormy Atlantic, Tale of the Cat and Valid Expectations.

I think I read Captain Bodgit or Will's Way - I can't remember which - is standing in Alberta somewhere for like $1500.

Of the ones you mentioned, Skip Away has to have been the biggest disappointment at stud.

It's difficult to pass on racing performance.

Compelling stuff, man. Nice job.

He was getting weight from Skip Away in every race except the Woodward, in case you didn't notice.

And his Woodward was his best race and easiest victory over Skip Away. Thank you for pointing out what I have said all along.....weight is meaningless. Much appreciated.

None of these top runners was fashionably-bred; in fact, they were all considered a bit 'down-market' in their breeding and were treated accordingly by the top tier breeders. They got the mares who were out of the half-sisters to the good runners instead of the half-sisters themselves, that sort of thing. Captain Bodgit died young, too.

Funny that a horse could run second twice while earning a 122 and 126 beyer. How times have changed.

I don't have Skip Away's PPs in front of me, and it's been 10 years. But other than his win over Cigar at Belmont, I seem to remember his biggest victories coming against suspect fields.

...and when is the last time the 5th place finisher in the BC Classic earned a 108?

I agree that some were not fashionably bred, but compared to the others listed above, Behrens (Pleasant Colony), Will's Way (Easy Goer) and Captain Bodgit (Saint Ballado) certainly fit the bill. Starting out, they were certainly no less fashionably bred than horses like Indian Charlie (In Excess), Valid Expectations (Valid Appeal), Northern Afleet (Afleet), and Smoke Glacken (Two Punch).

Horses like Distorted Humor, Arch, and Elusive Quality all began their careers at stud fees in the $10,000 range, so it's not like they were getting bred to top mares when they started out. They just outperformed their more recognizable (from a racing perspective) contemporaries in the breeding shed and, as a result, are now getting the top mares that they earned the hard way.

Finally, the Thoroughbred Times Stallion Directory lists Captain Bodgit as standing in Canada.