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Dunbar 11-16-2007 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jman5581
Yes, if they both don't go... cancelled. They both went here, or at least I think they did.

Right, they both went (finished 1st and 4th). I was just thinking about the future, short as it is! ;>)

--Dunbar

jman5581 11-17-2007 09:45 AM

GG R1 - 4 Haraka Haraka

HOL R3 - 2 Foxy Danseur

jman5581 11-17-2007 12:24 PM

short notice... R3 AQU #2 Malligitawny

jman5581 11-17-2007 12:31 PM

WON - Paid $2.90 - Running Total $219

Sorry for the quick play... that's one I had to jump on for the price.

jman5581 11-17-2007 01:20 PM

Also for today, with the SCR of Naughty New Yorker and Malibu Moonshine, I'll take Utopia in the Stuyvesant.

jman5581 11-17-2007 03:00 PM

Haraka Haraka WON paid $2.10 - Running Total = $230

Utopia 2nd paid $3.00 - Running Total = $345

Dunbar 11-17-2007 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jman5581
Haraka Haraka WON paid $2.10 - Running Total = $230

Utopia 2nd paid $3.00 - Running Total = $345

The first one put you at exactly even for flat betting all your show bets. The 2nd one put you at +0.4%, up $50 after 117 $100 bets.

Good work!

--Dunbar

jman5581 11-17-2007 05:09 PM

HOL R3 - 2 Foxy Danseur WON paid $2.10 - Running Total = $362


Hoping for some better prices in these next few...

jman5581 11-18-2007 08:54 AM

2 from HOL today... picks number 7 and 8 of this round...

R3 - 3 Butterfly Belle - going against the favorite Udriga for better price... seems to like this distance on the lawn and will gets tons of speed to close into. Isn't this the horse that Baze rode to pass Pincay in wins?
R4 - 5 Downthedustyroad - Baffert appears to have this one tightened up to give a winning effort.

Dunbar 11-18-2007 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jman5581
2 from HOL today... picks number 7 and 8 of this round...

R3 - 3 Butterfly Belle - going against the favorite Udriga for better price... seems to like this distance on the lawn and will gets tons of speed to close into. Isn't this the horse that Baze rode to pass Pincay in wins?
R4 - 5 Downthedustyroad - Baffert appears to have this one tightened up to give a winning effort.

jman, I think these are picks 8 and 9 of this round.

Also, it sounds like you're pressing to get a better payoff. IMO, better to just play your game than play catchup.

--Dunbar

jman5581 11-18-2007 10:06 AM

dammit, you're right! Good thing you're keeping track! This is picks 8 and 9, I missed Utopia when I was counting earlier.

Butterfly Belle looks like a very likely winner to me given the pace setup. I was going to say Udriga at first, but she's not a lock with the other early speed in there. Rosario knows the way with this one... ;)

jman5581 11-18-2007 03:40 PM

that never got going like it was supposed to... nobody fast enough to go with Udriga! She's a pretty good mare and it was dumb to bet against her looking back. For whatever reason, those pace meltdowns never seem to happen when I handicap the race. :)

Oh well... that's all she wrote for my little experiment.

Rd 20 ended after 7 successful picks and a topped out bankroll of $362.

Dunbar 11-19-2007 11:28 AM

Final stats for the 20 rounds:

Parlays
Just 1 parlay was completed, bringing home $1182. With 20 x $100 invested, the net loss on trying to parlay 10 winning show bets was $818, or -41%. Along the way, jman's virtual bankroll went down as low as -$1600.

Flat-betting
By the time the 20th Round ended, 119 horses were picked. A flat bet on those 119 horses would have yielded a loss of -0.4%. For $100 bets the loss would have been $45. A dart-thrower would have had a loss of more like $1900.

Along the way, $100 flat bets reached a high point of +$110 and a low point of -$385.

Additional Notes
Parlaying the show bets adds suspense but also adds a lot of risk. While the parlay result dipped down to -$1600 at one point, the flat bets were never more than $385 behind. In the end, parlaying resulted in 18 times as big a loss as flat-betting ($818 vs $45), even though the flat-bettor would have risked almost 6 times as much money ($2000 vs $11,900).

In the face of general negativity towards show bets, jman's results are remarkably good. I've got to catch a plane in a few hours, but at some point I'd like to write some more about the statistical significance of jman's results.

Nice job with the record-keeping, too, jman. It's tough to keep on top of the stats during a losing streak, but you never waivered from the original plan.

--Dunbar

jman5581 11-19-2007 11:57 AM

With regard to record keeping, one thing I wish I would have done but didn't is track the conditions of the races I played. I suppose I could go reconstruct that, but my general feeling is that I lost more often when betting claiming races than I did allowance, AOC or stakes. Case in point, Butterfly Belle yesterday in a MC32000. :) Were I to do the show parlay in real life (which I successfully have a couple times recently to build up some P3 and P4 cash) I would likely only bet on Allowance conditions or better. maybe i'm superstitious, but I genuinely perceive that I have more success at those levels than I do in claimers... and then again, maybe it's my sour disposition about Butterfly Belle ending my latest string of picks... :p

Dunbar 12-16-2007 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dunbar
1. 9/29 TP R10--Street Sense; 2nd, no show betting

2. 9/30 Bel R8--English Channel; won, pd $2.10, Running Total = $105.

--Dunbar

Okay, with #1 in the bag, the tortoise is ready for bet #2:

12/16 Sunland 9th, Pepper's Pride to show

--Dunbar

Dunbar 12-16-2007 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dunbar
Okay, with #1 in the bag, the tortoise is ready for bet #2:

12/16 Sunland 9th, Pepper's Pride to show

--Dunbar

Pepper's Pride won and paid $2.10 to show.

Running total after 2 bets is $110.25.

The average show pool today at Sunland had maybe $3500 in it. The 9th race (with Pepper's Pride) had a $150,000 show pool. 96.4% of the money in the pool (as shown by YouBet) was on Pepper's Pride. That's as high a percentage as I've seen.

--Dunbar

jman5581 12-17-2007 10:36 AM

Way to go Dunbar.. you're rollin' now.

jman5581 12-17-2007 10:39 AM

Just finished all my law school finals, so I've got time back on my hands... :)

dunbar, about a month ago you wrote... "I've got to catch a plane in a few hours, but at some point I'd like to write some more about the statistical significance of jman's results."

I'd be interested in hearing what it is you have to say.

Dunbar 12-17-2007 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jman5581
Way to go Dunbar.. you're rollin' now.

I'm rippin'. At my current rate of one pick every 2.5 months, I'll finish my first round of 10 in about August 2009, unless I pick a clunker and have to reset. Stay tuned. ;>)

Quote:

Originally Posted by jman5581
Just finished all my law school finals, so I've got time back on my hands... :)

dunbar, about a month ago you wrote... "I've got to catch a plane in a few hours, but at some point I'd like to write some more about the statistical significance of jman's results."

I'd be interested in hearing what it is you have to say.

hmmm. Oddly, it's going to probably take until my next flight before I have time to look at it again. But I'm glad you reminded me.

What I want to be able to say is something like, "there's just an 10% chance that jman is betting with worse than a 5% disadvantage." To do that, I need to calculate the standard deviation of your set of bets. It's easy, but like many easy things, it'll probably take an hour or 3 before I set it up right.

btw, the hypothetical quote above may not sound very impressive, but there are very few cappers who would be able to claim that level of success from a set of well-monitored picks .

--Dunbar


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