10/30 Notes: Rumors have Gio Ponti leaning to lawn

[Kasept]

Indications are that Gio Ponti is now leaning back towards a run in the Mile..

[mclem0822]

I spent the moring catching up on HRTV's Pursuit of The Cup series. Gary Stevens said his "sources" told him he would be going in the Mile. Which suprised me, i thought they were decided on the Classic.

[blackthroatedwind]

I spent the moring catching up on HRTV's Pursuit of The Cup series. Gary Stevens said his "sources" told him she would be going in the Mile. Which suprised me, i thought they were decided on the Classic.

I'm shocked to hear he's now a she.

[randallscott35]

Common sense taking hold.

[HaloWishingwell]

I'm shocked to hear he's now a she.

maybe they realize "she" would get a break in the weights.

[mclem0822]

I'm shocked to hear he's now a she.Happy to be corrected by a person of your stature kind sir.

[the_fat_man]

Happy to be corrected by a person of your stature kind sir.

Not like he ever makes 'gender' mistakes on the show.:rolleyes:

[Alan07]

Temple City will skip Breeders’ Cup Marathon (http://www.drf.com/news/temple-city-will-skip-breeders%E2%80%99-cup-marathon)

[chucklestheclown]

Temple City will skip Breeders’ Cup Marathon (http://www.derbytrail.com/news/temple-city-will-skip-breeders%E2%80%99-cup-marathon)

That link does not work for me.

[blackthroatedwind]

Not like he ever makes 'gender' mistakes on the show.:rolleyes:

Yes, and I'm happy when people make jokes about it.

The operative word being people. What species have you morphed into?

[Indian Charlie]

Yes, and I'm happy when people make jokes about it.

The operative word being people. What species have you morphed into?

http://redwing.hutman.net/~mreed/warriorshtm/troglodyte.htm

It even includes a picture.

[iamthelurker]

http://redwing.hutman.net/~mreed/warriorshtm/troglodyte.htm

It even includes a picture.

^ Win.

[iamthelurker]

And before he can say it, screw going to class.

[blackthroatedwind]

And before he can say it, screw going to class.

You seem to forget some of the phone numbers I possess.

[VOL JACK]

Common sense taking hold.

It should.

I understand them wanting to run him in the BC Classic.
What I don't understand is how they didn't give him a dirt trial run somewhere during the course of the year.
Especially the way some dirt G1's came up soft this year.

[Alan07]

Richard Hughes has raised the prospect of missing the ride on Paco Boy in the Breeders' Cup Turf Mile on Saturday to remain in Britain and continue his fight for a first jockeys' championship.

Should Hughes elect to stay in Britain and miss the ride on Paco Boy, Ryan Moore would pick up the ride according to trainer Richard Hannon.

http://www.racingpost.com/news/horse-racing/paco-boy-r-hughes-hughes-could-miss-breeders-cup-to-continue-title-race/784276/top/

[randallscott35]

Richard Hughes has raised the prospect of missing the ride on Paco Boy in the Breeders' Cup Turf Mile on Saturday to remain in Britain and continue his fight for a first jockeys' championship.

Should Hughes elect to stay in Britain and miss the ride on Paco Boy, Ryan Moore would pick up the ride according to trainer Richard Hannon.

http://www.racingpost.com/news/horse-racing/paco-boy-r-hughes-hughes-could-miss-breeders-cup-to-continue-title-race/784276/top/

Doesn't say much for his thoughts of Paco

[Kasept]

Doesn't say much for his thoughts of Paco
Not necessarily.. Hughes, 37, has a chance for what he thinks will be his only riding title. It's something that means a tremendous amount to him and to a rider's resume in the UK.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

that would be great for his chances imo 'the horse'

[Scav]

Not necessarily.. Hughes, 37, has a chance for what he thinks will be his only riding title. It's something that means a tremendous amount to him and to a rider's resume in the UK.

It is pretty impossible to win one of these right, because there are guys that ride two tracks, afternoon and night, and commute all over the place?

[brockguy]

It is pretty impossible to win one of these right, because there are guys that ride two tracks, afternoon and night, and commute all over the place?

yep Ryan Moore was fully expected to win it this year but was out for a while this year and that has opened it up to the relatively unheralded Paul Hanagan and Richard Hughes to win the title.

Ryan Moore might actually be a good fit for Paco (and has ridden him a few times before!). Im am hoping to God they actually try to put Paco in the race earlier than normal to try to get first run on Goldi and with Moore on board, they might just do it..

On the topic of Gio Ponti, I will be delighted if he takes money in the Mile.

[parsixfarms]

On the topic of Gio Ponti, I will be delighted if he takes money in the Mile.

Be careful what you wish for.

As a son of Tale of the Cat, I've always thought that a mile is Gio Ponti's best distance. After he won the Kilroe Mile last year (defeating eventual Woodbine Mile heroine Ventura), and in the absence of top mile races here, Clement took a chance that he could get 10F in the Manhattan against a relatively weak group, and he succeeded. They then became committed to a "distance" (by US standards) campaign with the horse.

His recent win in the Shadwell Mile was very impressive; he'll get plenty of pace with Sidney's Candy and Get Stormy in the field; and he has perhaps the best turf rider in Dominguez aboard. Compared to the likes of a past-his-prime Kip Deville and Whatsthescript (2008) and Cowboy Cal and Courageous Cat (2009), Gio Pinti will certainly present the most formidable American opponent that Goldikova has faced in her three Breeders' Cup tries.

[VOL JACK]

Kip Deville was every bit as formidable as Gio Ponti.

[brockguy]

Be careful what you wish for.

As a son of Tale of the Cat, I've always thought that a mile is Gio Ponti's best distance. After he won the Kilroe Mile last year (defeating eventual Woodbine Mile heroine Ventura), and in the absence of top mile races here, Clement took a chance that he could get 10F in the Manhattan against a relatively weak group, and he succeeded. They then became committed to a "distance" (by US standards) campaign with the horse.

His recent win in the Shadwell Mile was very impressive; he'll get plenty of pace with Sidney's Candy and Get Stormy in the field; and he has perhaps the best turf rider in Dominguez aboard. Compared to the likes of a past-his-prime Kip Deville and Whatsthescript (2008) and Cowboy Cal and Courageous Cat (2009), Gio Pinti will certainly present the most formidable American opponent that Goldikova has faced in her three Breeders' Cup tries.

Ive been wrong on countless occasions and will pay for it if Gio wins but I would be surprised.

I don't think he is as good as he was last year.

I don't think a mile is his best distance and I always prefer horses to be running at or slightly more than optimum trip.

and I dont think he was that impressive last time out.

I think Proviso has a better shot than he does and I hate Proviso here!!!

[parsixfarms]

Kip Deville was every bit as formidable as Gio Ponti.

Not in 2008. He was coming into the BC that year off a bad 5th at 1-2 in the Woodbine Mile behind Rahy's Attorney and Ventura.

[RockHardTen1985]

Ive been wrong on countless occasions and will pay for it if Gio wins but I would be surprised.

I don't think he is as good as he was last year.

I don't think a mile is his best distance and I always prefer horses to be running at or slightly more than optimum trip.

and I dont think he was that impressive last time out.

I think Proviso has a better shot than he does and I hate Proviso here!!!

Proviso is working really well and I give her a chance to upset this thing.

[hockey2315]

Gio is officially going in the mile.

[RockHardTen1985]

This sounds shitty....

Sidney's Candy (Mile, five furlongs in 1:00.89): California invader was very aggressive leaving the pole and had to be given a left-handed tap of the whip to keep from lugging into the cones when he began to take a bit of an erratic path near the eighth pole. He finished and galloped out willingly enough under some late encouragement, but he just doesn't give the impression he's going to be able to carry his speed the distance against the quality group he will encounter in the Mile.

[chucklestheclown]

This sounds shitty....

Sidney's Candy (Mile, five furlongs in 1:00.89): California invader was very aggressive leaving the pole and had to be given a left-handed tap of the whip to keep from lugging into the cones when he began to take a bit of an erratic path near the eighth pole. He finished and galloped out willingly enough under some late encouragement, but he just doesn't give the impression he's going to be able to carry his speed the distance against the quality group he will encounter in the Mile.

I have no doubt that somebody said this; the question is, who was it? As much as I respect the horse I think Sadler has done terribly by him and the fact his sale isn't finalized yet (to my knowledge) leads me to believe I'm not the only one having second thoughts about a once-fine colt. I won't put a penny on him unless he's post 3 or 4.

Who are you quoting?

[ateamstupid]

I have no doubt that somebody said this; the question is, who was it? As much as I respect the horse I think Sadler has done terribly by him and the fact his sale isn't finalized yet (to my knowledge) leads me to believe I'm not the only one having second thoughts about a once-fine colt. I won't put a penny on him unless he's post 3 or 4.

Who are you quoting?

You wouldn't be interested. It's on a site that sells past performances. And to anybody remotely familiar with BC coverage, there's no mystery as to who said it.

[Arletta]

I have no doubt that somebody said this; the question is, who was it? As much as I respect the horse I think Sadler has done terribly by him and the fact his sale isn't finalized yet (to my knowledge) leads me to believe I'm not the only one having second thoughts about a once-fine colt. I won't put a penny on him unless he's post 3 or 4.

Who are you quoting?

Mike Welsch.

[chucklestheclown]

Mike Welsch.

Thanks R; I've been forced to concentrate on the horses themselves and haven't been reading much outside the boards and the occasional article. That'll change when I pick up the DRF (tonight?)

[Kasept]

I have no doubt that somebody said this; the question is, who was it? As much as I respect the horse I think Sadler has done terribly by him and the fact his sale isn't finalized yet (to my knowledge) leads me to believe I'm not the only one having second thoughts about a once-fine colt. I won't put a penny on him unless he's post 3 or 4.

Who are you quoting?

There never was a 'sale', a 'pending sale', a 'possible sale' or likely even an inquiry. I'm kind of against Sidney's Candy, but the sale thing shouldn't hold you back if you liked him. He looked great in his spin.

[chucklestheclown]

There never was a 'sale', a 'pending sale', a 'possible sale' or likely even an inquiry. I'm kind of against Sidney's Candy, but the sale thing shouldn't hold you back if you liked him. He looked great in his spin.

So you're calling Sadler a liar? I read at least 3 articles in Bloodhorse and elsewhere saying he was being sold and the first excuse was the banks were closed on Columbus day...it went downhill from there.

[Indian Charlie]

Trainers never lie.

I can just see it now.

The 'buyer' decides to buy Sidney's Candy, he must have it now, on Columbus Day!

Not before Columbus day, but exactly on Columbus Day. When they find out he can't buy SC on Columbus Day, he/they throw a tantrum or get second thoughts, like it's a sign from Allah, and change their mind the next day.

[Bogey]

Trainers never lie.

I can just see it now.

The 'buyer' decides to buy Sidney's Candy, he must have it now, on Columbus Day!

Not before Columbus day, but exactly on Columbus Day. When they find out he can't buy SC on Columbus Day, he/they throw a tantrum or get second thoughts, like it's a sign from Allah, and change their mind the next day.I always thought Columbus was Catholic.

[Indian Charlie]

I always thought Columbus was Catholic.

The rumor was that it was a follower of Allah that was interested in buying SC.

But yeah, I hadn't considered that angle!

[Bogey]

The rumor was that it was a follower of Allah that was interested in buying SC.

But yeah, I hadn't considered that angle!The whole purchase deal is bizarre and you might have figured it out with the Allah angle.

[hockey2315]

I thought there were vet issues.

[ateamstupid]

Be careful what you wish for.

As a son of Tale of the Cat, I've always thought that a mile is Gio Ponti's best distance. After he won the Kilroe Mile last year (defeating eventual Woodbine Mile heroine Ventura), and in the absence of top mile races here, Clement took a chance that he could get 10F in the Manhattan against a relatively weak group, and he succeeded. They then became committed to a "distance" (by US standards) campaign with the horse.

His recent win in the Shadwell Mile was very impressive; he'll get plenty of pace with Sidney's Candy and Get Stormy in the field; and he has perhaps the best turf rider in Dominguez aboard. Compared to the likes of a past-his-prime Kip Deville and Whatsthescript (2008) and Cowboy Cal and Courageous Cat (2009), Gio Pinti will certainly present the most formidable American opponent that Goldikova has faced in her three Breeders' Cup tries.

Come on. He's the best of a dreadful group of U.S. turf horses. His Shadwell wasn't very impressive, it was fine. He'd have to put in an easy lifetime best to beat Goldikova and Paco Boy and if he's under 10-1, that's a bad bet.

[hockey2315]

Come on. He's the best of a dreadful group of U.S. turf horses. His Shadwell wasn't very impressive, it was fine. He'd have to put in an easy lifetime best to beat Goldikova and Paco Boy and if he's under 10-1, that's a bad bet.

Really?

[ateamstupid]

Really?

What the hell was so impressive about it? He beat freaking Society's Chairman by a length and ran slower than Proviso.

[hockey2315]

What the hell was so impressive about it? He beat freaking Society's Chairman by a length and ran slower than Proviso.

Maybe your opinion of Gio stems in part from your feelings about Proviso. . . I don't share your view of her. Gio couldn't really have done it any easier and got another overconfident ride from Ramon. You know the margin doesn't matter there - he came home extremely quick and got up comfortably.

[ateamstupid]

Maybe your opinion of Gio stems in part from your feelings about Proviso. . . I don't share your view of her. Gio couldn't really have done it any easier and got another overconfident ride from Ramon. You know the margin doesn't matter there - he came home extremely quick and got up comfortably.

They're both the best of bad divisions and are outclassed by Goldikova and Paco Boy. You don't agree with this?

[blackthroatedwind]

I thought Gio Ponti's win at Keeneland was decidedly mediocre.

[hockey2315]

They're both the best of bad divisions and are outclassed by Goldikova and Paco Boy. You don't agree with this?

I don't really see the point in using Paco Boy or boxing those two like you seem to want to - Goldikova has already asserted her superiority over him. I'll use Goldi and protect with Gio and Proviso in case she gets sucked up into the pace.

[ateamstupid]

I don't really see the point in using Paco Boy or boxing those two like you seem to want to - Goldikova has already asserted her superiority over him. I'll use Goldi and protect with Gio and Proviso in case she gets sucked up into the pace.

Please. He's hardly getting trounced by her. He's lost by two necks and a half-length and in my book that makes him a hell of a lot more likely to win this than Gio Ponti or Proviso.

[blackthroatedwind]

Please. He's hardly getting trounced by her. He's lost by two necks and a half-length and in my book that makes him a hell of a lot more likely to win this than Gio Ponti or Proviso.

Have you watched the three races between Goldikova and Paco Boy this year?

You should. He can't get by her when it matters. He's Alydar to her Affirmed.

[Scav]

Have you watched the three races between Goldikova and Paco Boy this year?

You should. He can't get by her when it matters. He's Alydar to her Affirmed.

Exactly

[hockey2315]

Isn't she better on firm turf? We know she can ship. . . We have no idea if he can ship and no reason to believe he'll improve on firm turf. It's not like he's lighting things up when he's not facing her. His last win came over the very mediocre Ouqba and the Lord Shanakill, who's better at 7f. His last win before that came over Pressing, who's like a German and Turkish Group 1 horse. I guess I could use Paco Boy as a last resort w/ some of my longer priced stuff so I don't get knocked out of the late Pk4 in the first leg, but to treat them as equals just because she's barely beating him seems like a stretch.

[ateamstupid]

Have you watched the three races between Goldikova and Paco Boy this year?

You should. He can't get by her when it matters. He's Alydar to her Affirmed.

Yeah, I have. He was wider than she was in the Foret and got a little stuck late in the Queen Anne. Affirmed/Alydar would be the analogy I'd make too though.

My point wasn't that he's going to beat her, it's that if she loses, it's extremely likely to be him and not Gio Ponti or Proviso that takes her down.

[RockHardTen1985]

Yeah, I have. He was wider than she was in the Foret and got a little stuck late in the Queen Anne.

My point wasn't that he's going to beat her, it's that if she loses, it's extremely likely to be him and not Gio Ponti or Proviso that takes her down.

Paco Boy cant beat her, Id rather take a chance with Get Stormy, Sidneys Candy stealing.... One of them quits, stumbles whatever the other gets brave. Or Proviso then Paco Boy who has proven MANY TIMES, HE CANT BEAT HER. I would rather give someone else a chance at 4-10x the price.

[blackthroatedwind]

Yeah, I have. He was wider than she was in the Foret and got a little stuck late in the Queen Anne.

My point wasn't that he's going to beat her, it's that if she loses, it's extremely likely to be him and not Gio Ponti or Proviso that takes her down.

I don't agree with a lot of this. I agree that Gio Ponti and, especially, Proviso are unlikely to beat her. I would be more worried about a relative unknown like Sidney's Candy wiring the field.

I don't feel he's a major win candidate but I'm not completely against the Usual QT.

[ateamstupid]

I don't agree with a lot of this. I agree that Gio Ponti and, especially, Proviso are unlikely to beat her. I would be more worried about a relative unknown like Sidney's Candy wiring the field.

I don't feel he's a major win candidate but I'm not completely against the Usual QT.

I thought he ran the better race than Court Vision at Woodbine, so yeah, he's not impossible. I take it you're singling Goldikova then?

[Scav]

I don't agree with a lot of this. I agree that Gio Ponti and, especially, Proviso are unlikely to beat her. I would be more worried about a relative unknown like Sidney's Candy wiring the field.

I don't feel he's a major win candidate but I'm not completely against the Usual QT.

FWIW, I thought Sidney's Candy work look horrible over the turf at Churchill. I wasn't on The Usual Q.T until someone I respect called me and said some well regarded Cali people were pushing him pretty heavy. An underneath candidate for me.

[hockey2315]

Yeah, I have. He was wider than she was in the Foret and got a little stuck late in the Queen Anne. Affirmed/Alydar would be the analogy I'd make too though.

My point wasn't that he's going to beat her, it's that if she loses, it's extremely likely to be him and not Gio Ponti or Proviso that takes her down.

You really think he had a harder trip than she did in the Foret? She was up close to what seems like a lively enough pace while he was doing the usual Euro thing, drafting behind horses in the two path (big deal). She gave up the lead, and then took it right back pretty easily. He had every chance to outkick her.

I understand what you're saying and obviously just disagree about how good he is and how good the Americans are. We both think she's a very likely winner.

[hockey2315]

If Sidney's Candy got his prep in and validated his last performance, I'd like him a lot. . . now I don't trust him at all.

[RockHardTen1985]

FWIW, I thought Sidney's Candy work look horrible over the turf at Churchill. I wasn't on The Usual Q.T until someone I respect called me and said some well regarded Cali people were pushing him pretty heavy. An underneath candidate for me.

Get Stormy is not impossible IMO. DRF is reporting Sidneys Candy is not working well, not finishing well. He runs off early, stops... Stormy takes over... He could get brave at over 20-1. Why is it unreasonable to think a horse like Sidneys Candy might just run like **** off this layoff vs this type?

[hockey2315]

Get Stormy is not impossible IMO. DRF is reporting Sidneys Candy is not working well, not finishing well. He runs off early, stops... Stormy takes over... He could get brave at over 20-1. Why is it unreasonable to think a horse like Sidneys Candy might just run like **** off this layoff vs this type?

I'm a fan of Get Stormy, but he has 0 shot in this race. He spits the bit when he doesn't get things his own way.

[Scav]

Get Stormy is not impossible IMO. DRF is reporting Sidneys Candy is not working well, not finishing well. He runs off early, stops... Stormy takes over... He could get brave at over 20-1. Why is it unreasonable to think a horse like Sidneys Candy might just run like **** off this layoff vs this type?

Impossible

[CSC]

Firmer ground will help Paco Boy, having Hughes opt for a riding title is also an add on bonus, Moore should give him a good trip, he's a very strong finisher, tactically if he can get 1st run on Goldikova he can certainly turn the tables on her. However the negative is he does seem to be getting alot of attention right now and she is a very formidable opponent.

[hockey2315]

Firmer ground will help Paco Boy, having Hughes opt for a riding title is also an add on bonus, Moore should give him a good trip, he's a very strong finisher, tactically if he can get 1st run on Goldikova he can certainly turn the tables. However he does seem to be getting alot of attention right now and she is a very formidable opponent.

Will someone please enlighten me as to why this is the general consensus? I don't see it.

[NTamm1215]

The thing about beating her is that she's very handy. It seems like she's adaptable to any scenario and Peslier knows he can do pretty much anything with her and still have success. If you compare the internal fractions of the Foret to the Grand Criterium for 2YOs on the same card at the same distance (the race Utley exits) she was 1.3 seconds quicker to the 800m mark and 0.9 seconds faster at the finish. What that probably means is that Wooton Bassett would win the Juv Turf by open lengths, but that's neither here nor there.

A very strong pace going two turns could help Paco Boy's chances but she'd need to be very rank and falter late, something it looks like she's just not going to do.

I like Gio Ponti's chances more than most and don't necessarily think his credentials for this race should be judged solely based on the Shadwell.

[blackthroatedwind]

I thought he ran the better race than Court Vision at Woodbine, so yeah, he's not impossible. I take it you're singling Goldikova then?

I hadn't really thought about it. But, no....I will certainly use Sidney's Candy.

[hockey2315]

The thing about beating her is that she's very handy. It seems like she's adaptable to any scenario and Peslier knows he can do pretty much anything with her and still have success. If you compare the internal fractions of the Foret to the Grand Criterium for 2YOs on the same card at the same distance (the race Utley exits) she was 1.3 seconds quicker to the 800m mark and 0.9 seconds faster at the finish. What that probably means is that Wooton Bassett would win the Juv Turf by open lengths, but that's neither here nor there.

A very strong pace going two turns could help Paco Boy's chances but she'd need to be very rank and falter late, something it looks like she's just not going to do.

I like Gio Ponti's chances more than most and don't necessarily think his credentials for this race should be judged solely based on the Shadwell.

Very good point.

[CSC]

Will someone please enlighten me as to why this is the general consensus? I don't see it.

The track here could make all the difference, if the BC were being held in Europe I too would have reservations about his chances. You don't need me to tell you Paco Boy has an exceptional turn of foot, he doesn't need to wind up as say Workforce needs to, to get going. Tactically he has always been running at Goldikova, but over here if Moore can get him in a position of where Goldikova was in last year, it would make things interesting atleast. She was farther back than Peslier probably wanted, if that was PB she was running at, the result could have turned out different.

[hockey2315]

The track here could make all the difference, if the BC were being held in Europe I too would have reservations about his chances. You don't need me to tell you Paco Boy has an exceptional turn of foot, he doesn't need to wind up as say Workforce needs to, to get going. Tactically he has always been running at Goldikova, but over here if Moore can get him in a position of Goldikova was in last year, it would make things interesting atleast.

WHAT IS YOUR EVIDENCE THAT THE TRACK WILL MAKE A DIFFERENCE? Clearly she likes firm turf. . . a lot.

It's worthless to argue about an even money shot this much, but I just don't see why everyone has come to the conclusion that the turf condition will move up Paco Boy so much without moving Goldikova equally (or more). Weren't they considering scratching her from the Foret because it was too soft?

[ateamstupid]

The thing about beating her is that she's very handy. It seems like she's adaptable to any scenario and Peslier knows he can do pretty much anything with her and still have success.

I agree with this. It was really something to behold in the Foret when he let Regal Parade blow past her and didn't move a muscle.

I like Gio Ponti's chances more than most and don't necessarily think his credentials for this race should be judged solely based on the Shadwell.

Very good point.

I don't know if that was directed at me, but I'm certainly not doing that. I simply took issue with the idea that his Shadwell was 'very impressive'. I don't like him because I think he's slower than last year and has gotten fat beating terrible U.S. turf horses.

[CSC]

WHAT IS YOUR EVIDENCE THAT THE TRACK WILL MAKE A DIFFERENCE? Clearly she likes firm turf. . . a lot.

It's worthless to argue about an even money shot this much, but I just don't see why everyone has come to the conclusion that the turf condition will move up Paco Boy so much without moving Goldikova equally (or more). Weren't they considering scratching her from the Foret because it was too soft?

I mean't the configuration, not the surface. It's tighter and the stretch is shorter, tactically it is a whole different ballgame over here. Over there it is cover and long runs in the straight, you just can't compare the 2 tracks.

[hockey2315]

I mean't the configuration, not the surface. It's tighter and the stretch is shorter, tactically it is a whole different ballgame over here. Over there it is cover and long runs in the straight, you just can't compare the 2 tracks.

She clearly likes a more American configuration and probably has less of a European style than he does. I'm still not getting it, but whatever.

[Dahoss]

I like Gio Ponti's chances more than most and don't necessarily think his credentials for this race should be judged solely based on the Shadwell.

I agree and I think he has a very good shot to win in here. I'll be using him and Goldikova equally and maybe Paco Boy or Beethoven in pick 4's. If Sidney's Candy wins, he beats me because I think the unplanned layoff is a concern and he's just not going to run off against a full field like he did last time.

[CSC]

She clearly likes a more American configuration and probably has less of a European style than he does. I'm still not getting it, but whatever.

Like I said she is a formidable opponent, look at last year's mile, she was much the best IMO, however I don't think she can afford the same trip this year, I make no illusions about it she is the horse to beat, but if PB runs his race, I do think this year's task will be much harder. He's had some luckless runs ie. Prix Du Moulin, and has encountered races on less than his favorable going. I doubt he's going to be a secret, but you have to atleast consider him as one of the more logical ones if Goldikova falls.

[NTamm1215]

I agree with this. It was really something to behold in the Foret when he let Regal Parade blow past her and didn't move a muscle.

I don't know if that was directed at me, but I'm certainly not doing that. I simply took issue with the idea that his Shadwell was 'very impressive'. I don't like him because I think he's slower than last year and has gotten fat beating terrible U.S. turf horses.

I was just saying it in general, not specifically to you.

I think that Gio Ponti has certainly benefited from a time period when US based turf horses are awful, that goes without saying. However, I don't necessarily think his 2010 races have been any worse than 2009. The Dubai World Cup was underrated all things considered.

I'll give him the Manhattan off the bench and it's not like Winchester hasn't backed it up just a bit. He basically did his best Zenyatta imitation in the Man O War coming from well off a brutally slow pace. Ramon did not give him a good ride in the Arl Million at all and the paid the price.

I've also been of the opinion for quite some time that a mile is his best distance. If I'm right then I'll win, if I'm wrong then I think Goldikova goes three in a row. I'm not spending one cent on Sidney's Candy.

[ateamstupid]

I've also been of the opinion for quite some time that a mile is his best distance. If I'm right then I'll win, if I'm wrong then I think Goldikova goes three in a row. I'm not spending one cent on Sidney's Candy.

To me, that's the only way he has a shot. Because if he runs the races he ran at 10-11 furlongs on Saturday, he'll get stomped.

[Indian Charlie]

I believe The QT and Candy are the two most likely upsetters in here.

My impression of Gio is that he's a horse that can beat low quality fields, but when going up against genuinely good horses, he runs a few placings back.

[Dahoss]

I believe The QT and Candy are the two most likely upsetters in here.

My impression of Gio is that he's a horse that can beat low quality fields, but when going up against genuinely good horses, he runs a few placings back.

Have you looked at Gio's PP's? What are you basing it on?

[NTamm1215]

I believe The QT and Candy are the two most likely upsetters in here.

My impression of Gio is that he's a horse that can beat low quality fields, but when going up against genuinely good horses, he runs a few placings back.

I think it's kind of funny that you question Gio Ponti's ability against genuinely good horses after you said you think The Usual QT and Sidney's Candy can win the race. I'd take any of the also rans in just the Shadwell (save Acting Zippy) against Kid Edward, Alphie's Bet, Victor's Cry, and Battle of Hastings any day of the week.

[Indian Charlie]

I think it's kind of funny that you question Gio Ponti's ability against genuinely good horses after you said you think The Usual QT and Sidney's Candy can win the race. I'd take any of the also rans in just the Shadwell (save Acting Zippy) against Kid Edward, Alphie's Bet, Victor's Cry, and Battle of Hastings any day of the week.

Let me amend what I said. Or at least how I said it.

I like QT's and SC's chances at their odds MUCH more than I like GP's chances at his low odds.

I also think they both have a nicer turn of foot than GP.

SC is a complete wild card in this race. He could win, or he could jump the rail, who knows.

I would take QT in a heads up against GP.

[chucklestheclown]

I thought there were vet issues.

There probably were and he won't be anywhere but 4th for me. And that's a stretch.

[Alan07]

Indian Gracey was to be scratched from the Breeders’ Cup Juvenile Fillies on Friday because of soreness in her right front foot, trainer Jerry Hollendorfer said Thursday morning.

Hollendorfer first noticed the problem on Wednesday morning, but wanted to wait a day to see if the filly responded to treatment. At the time, Hollendorfer thought there was a chance she would respond and make the race. But by Thursday morning, he realized he was running out of time, and decided to pass.

http://drf.com/news/indian-gracey-be-scratched-breeders-cup-juvenile-fillies

[clyde]

Let me amend what I said. Or at least how I said it.

I like QT's and SC's chances at their odds MUCH more than I like GP's chances at his low odds.

I also think they both have a nicer turn of foot than GP.

SC is a complete wild card in this race. He could win, or he could jump the rail, who knows.

I would take QT in a heads up against GP.

Drink your mookies.