7/10 (HOL): Hollywood Gold Cup & Triple Bend H. (G1's)

[Kasept]

6th (3:35) Triple Bend H. (G1)

7 Furlongs (All Weather Track) | Open | 3 Year Olds And Up Stakes | Purse: $250,000

1 E Z's Gentleman Pedroza M A 116 L
2 Fantasy Free Berrio O A 114 L
3 M One Rifle Smith M E 117 L
4 Gayego Bejarano R 122
5 Bestdressed Espinoza V 114 L
6 Sangaree Garcia M 116 L
7 My Summer Slew Quinonez A 114 L
8 New Bay Baze T C 114 L



8th (4:35) Hollywood Gold Cup H. (G1)

1 1/4 Miles (All Weather Track) | Open | 3 Year Olds And Up Stakes | Purse: $500,000

1 Cigar Man Talamo J 113 L
2 Compari Smith M E 117 L
3 Awesome Gem Flores D R 116 L
4 Richard's Kid Garcia M 121
5 Tres Borrachos Espinoza V 113 L
6 Rail Trip Bejarano R 123 L
7 Tap It Light Baze T C 114 L

[the_fat_man]

Would love to have seen the, POTENTIAL, Horse of the Year, Quality Road, entered in this race. Shouldn't the, presently, BEST DIRT HORSE in training be able to handle a bunch of turfers and POLY lovers? Why are they forcing the poor horse to run exclusively on dirt? Ship him across the country. Put him on another surface so we can see how a superior horse runs.:rolleyes:

[cmorioles]

Yeah, that makes sense, ship a superior dirt horse across the country to run against poly and turf lovers on polyturf. Great plan. As an aside, I don't think Rail Trip is winning that race.

[NTamm1215]

Would love to have seen the, POTENTIAL, Horse of the Year, Quality Road, entered in this race. Shouldn't the, presently, BEST DIRT HORSE in training be able to handle a bunch of turfers and POLY lovers? Why are they forcing the poor horse to run exclusively on dirt? Ship him across the country. Put him on another surface so we can see how a superior horse runs.:rolleyes:

Wouldn't it have been easier for the greatest synthetic horse of all time to just pop out of her stall and beat these horses? It's not like it would have been much of a ship.

NT

[the_fat_man]

Now, NTamm, is the preeminent back handed Z supporter online presently. He never misses a chance to bring Z into just about ANY argument, negatively, while insisting that he appreciates her ability.

Way to go, Nick.

[NTamm1215]

Now, NTamm, is the preeminent back handed Z supporter online presently. He never misses a chance to bring Z into just about ANY argument, negatively, while insisting that he appreciates her ability.

Way to go, Nick.

Appreciating her ability and thinking her connections are putting her through a worthless campaign are not mutually exclusive.

You don't have a sound reason for her not running here though, right?

NT

[the_fat_man]

Yeah, that makes sense, ship a superior dirt horse across the country to run against poly and turf lovers on polyturf. Great plan.

In other words, he falls flat on his face on a non speed favoring surface.

[the_fat_man]

Appreciating her ability and thinking her connections are putting her through a worthless campaign are not mutually exclusive.

You don't have a sound reason for her not running here though, right?

NT

I do. They gain NOTHING by running her in that spot, assuming they're objective for coming back was Horse of the Year. They started the year with a two pronged path:

1) Beat the reigning Horse of the Year in OP
and/or
2 Win the Classic again

Since 1 fell through, circumstances beyond their control, they're left with 2.
Explain to me how beating Rail Trip or Richard's Kid helps her?

If she doesn't win the classic, she's not HOTY. If she doesn't do the Classic and wins the GC, she's not HOTY. See a pattern?

[NTamm1215]

I do. They gain NOTHING by running her in that spot, assuming they're objective for coming back was Horse of the Year. They started the year with a two pronged path:

1) Beat the reigning Horse of the Year in OP
and/or
2 Win the Classic again

Since 1 fell through, circumstances beyond their control, they're left with 2.
Explain to me how beating Rail Trip or Richard's Kid helps her?

If she doesn't win the classic, she's not HOTY. If she doesn't do the Classic and wins the GC, she's not HOTY. See a pattern?

So you've bought into the whole "Classic or die" mantra that the Moss/Shirreffs/Zenyatta gang has propagated now. I would have thought that someone with the appreciation of racing you have would recognize that a campaign pointed towards one race doesn't necessarily have to include the easiest stops along the way. When dealing with a seemingly great horse, why take the easy road with 6-7 week (or more) breaks? I blame Pletcher as much as anyone for doing it too.

I can tell you this much, if she was running in races like the GC and Pacific Classic and winning them, a 2nd place finish in the BCC with an upset from a new shooter would still equal a HOTY. You still have to try to build a resume to some extent. One that goes a bit beyond the Vanity and Hirsch IMO.

NT

[RolloTomasi]

As an aside, I don't think Rail Trip is winning that race.
What's your reasoning behind this?

[cmorioles]

In other words, he falls flat on his face on a non speed favoring surface.

I don't think it has anything to do with speed favoring. It is a distinctly DIFFERENT surface. I wouldn't expect him to win if she shipped to Europe to run in a G1 turf race either.

[cmorioles]

What's your reasoning behind this?

I haven't been that blown away by his races this year, and I don't think 10f is his best distance either. The track is not playing to his style like it was last year also, in my opinion.

[the_fat_man]

So, your argument, now, is that a 6 year old mare needs to put in her most ambitious year of racing to date, then, turn in a good showing in the GC, to get HOTY. If she were my horse and I had your option on #2 above, I'd go with #2 every time. I'm pretty sure, under those circumstances, you'd go for #2 as well. This horse has done enough, IMO. Keep her fit and try dirt at CD.

[the_fat_man]

I don't think it has anything to do with speed favoring. It is a distinctly DIFFERENT surface. I wouldn't expect him to win if she shipped to Europe to run in a G1 turf race either.

I think it has EVERYTHING to do with speed favoring when it comes to him. That's my point.

[NTamm1215]

So, your argument, now, is that a 6 year old mare needs to put in her most ambitious year of racing to date, then, turn in a good showing in the GC, to get HOTY. If she were my horse and I had your option on #2 above, I'd go with #2 every time. I'm pretty sure, under those circumstances, you'd go for #2 as well. This horse has done enough, IMO. Keep her fit and try dirt at CD.

So because they've put her through similarly weak and unimaginative campaigns pre-BC in the last two years it's OK for them to do it again?

If she were my horse we would have logged so many frequent flier miles I'd practically own Tex Sutton. Clearly, I wouldn't have been afraid to lose.

NT

[Indian Charlie]

Wasn't that long ago, really, when the Z connections were almost certain they weren't running in the Classic last year. Now? Now it's the end all.

[Danzig]

So, your argument, now, is that a 6 year old mare needs to put in her most ambitious year of racing to date, then, turn in a good showing in the GC, to get HOTY. If she were my horse and I had your option on #2 above, I'd go with #2 every time. I'm pretty sure, under those circumstances, you'd go for #2 as well. This horse has done enough, IMO. Keep her fit and try dirt at CD.

lol
she's 6, not 16. 17 whole races under her belt...yeah, she's used up. :rolleyes: when is she going to get started on her most ambitious year? there's no reason she can't take on males in a race other than the classic...surely you don't subscribe to the 'mares shouldn't take on males' theory? you don't think she'd run harder because it's out of her usual sex? she sure didn't look done in after the classic. besides, the classic alone didn't get her HOY last year, i doubt it alone gets her that this year either.

[Duvalier]

Zenyatta's not in either of these races. Why make every f'kn thread about Zenyatta or Rachel? Same people over and over.

[RolloTomasi]

Zenyatta's not in either of these races.
Isn't that the main complaint?

[Port Conway Lane]

She barely squeaks out a win in the Vanity against a horse who was trounced by males in her previous start and she is supposed to run in the Gold Cup against the best male in California. Makes sense.

[RolloTomasi]

lol
she's 6, not 16. 17 whole races under her belt...yeah, she's used up. :rolleyes: when is she going to get started on her most ambitious year? there's no reason she can't take on males in a race other than the classic...surely you don't subscribe to the 'mares shouldn't take on males' theory? you don't think she'd run harder because it's out of her usual sex? she sure didn't look done in after the classic. besides, the classic alone didn't get her HOY last year, i doubt it alone gets her that this year either.
The Fat Man is just issuing a double bind here while trying to play both sides of the fence at the same time.

Zenyatta shouldn't run against Rail Trip because he's not important and beating him does nothing for her in regards to Horse Of The Year. At the same time, she shouldn't run against Rail Trip because he makes the Hollywood Gold Cup too ambitious a spot for her on the road (Easy Street?) towards HOY.

Maybe we should call him "The Fat Man With No Name" with all the spaghetti western posturing he does around here.

Better get a few coffins ready...

[RolloTomasi]

She barely squeaks out a win in the Vanity against a horse who was trounced by males in her previous start and she is supposed to run in the Gold Cup against the best male in California. Makes sense.
So you're saying she is clearly not the best horse in training?

[Port Conway Lane]

So you're saying she is clearly not the best horse in training?

I'm saying that.

[Port Conway Lane]

I'm not alone evidently.

[RolloTomasi]

I'm saying that.
Fair enough. Even if it's a step down from what most people envisioned for her 2010 campaign, there has to be some interest in seeing Zenyatta take on St. Trinians a second time in the Clement Hirsch.

It's just disappointing that it will "waste" another start in familiar territory.

[ateamstupid]

I do. They gain NOTHING by running her in that spot, assuming they're objective for coming back was Horse of the Year. They started the year with a two pronged path:

1) Beat the reigning Horse of the Year in OP
and/or
2 Win the Classic again

Since 1 fell through, circumstances beyond their control, they're left with 2.
Explain to me how beating Rail Trip or Richard's Kid helps her?

If she doesn't win the classic, she's not HOTY. If she doesn't do the Classic and wins the GC, she's not HOTY. See a pattern?

This is complete crap. Quality Road is light years ahead of Zenyatta at this point, and that gap only gets bigger and bigger after he wins the Whitney and Woodward. If she were the favorite for HOY at this point, your argument would make some sense, but she's not. She already has significant ground to make up, and we're only halfway through the year. Unless QR slips up considerably, a Classic win alone won't cut it.

[Danzig]

i agree, quality road is the top of the heap....

and this ought to fan some flames:

http://www.racingpost.com/news/horse-racing/dick-turpin-r-hannon-twice-over-chantilly-hannon-shows-yet-again-shows-hes-no-one-trick-pony-july-5/738221/worldclass/


charts for top horses at the bottom of the page.

[hockey2315]

Racing Post ratings are so funny.

[Indian Charlie]

How did St. Trinians not make that list?

[Port Conway Lane]

How did St. Trinians not make that list?

Seriously. This confirms the list is bogus.

[tiggerv]

I expected 20 pages in this thread from the Zenyatta haters/fans but complaints about Quality Road? Really? It's a good idea to ship QR all the way to California to run 10F on synthetic but it's too ambitious to ask the big mare to walk 100 feet down the shed row to run her best surface and distance?? :zz:

Sheriffs ran Life Is Sweet in this spot last year but apparently challenging his best mare more than once a year is too much. The lack of good horses in this country has really created some chicken **** owners who do whatever they can to avoid losing and then act like they are doing fans a favor.

[CSC]

Richard's Kid should be enough to put down the ridiculous hype that is Rail Trip.

[10 pnt move up]

Richard's Kid should be enough to put down the ridiculous hype that is Rail Trip.

Maybe at Del Mar where the surface is a complete joke.

[CSC]

Maybe at Del Mar where the surface is a complete joke.

It doesn't help, however you have to think he will be a fair price given the layoff. This is one you have to have faith in the trainer that the horse will fire, I really like Baffert these days, he has figured out how to train for synth.

[NTamm1215]

It doesn't help, however you have to think he will be a fair price given the layoff. This is one you have to have faith in the trainer that the horse will fire, I really like Baffert these days, he has figured out how to train for synth.

It's been a while but Baffert lost with both Captain Steve and Silver Charm coming back from Dubai. Both lost at very short prices in their returns.

NT

[CSC]

It's been a while but Baffert lost with both Captain Steve and Silver Charm coming back from Dubai. Both lost at very short prices in their returns.

NT

Obviously, it isn't ideal having a horse making their return in a grade 1 off of a 3+ month layoff, I'm not really a believer in the Dubai curse thing anyway, this will be a good test for Rail Trip carrying 123.

[slotdirt]

I've never been one to think Richard's Kid coming into any race off any sort of layoff is an ideal situation.

[10 pnt move up]

I've never been one to think Richard's Kid coming into any race off any sort of layoff is an ideal situation.

The layoff is secondary to his ability.

They talk about a fast pace, dont see it, Compari will go out fairly moderate and Tres Berrachos will stalk and try to get first run in front of rail trip. I bet rail trip opens up 5 into the stretch before Richards Kid starts passing the tiring horses.

[CSC]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JShbOgXpqZw

[NTamm1215]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JShbOgXpqZw

No way, a trainer entering a horse in a GI race is confident about their chances.

That was enlightening.

NT

[CSC]

No way, a trainer entering a horse in a GI race is confident about their chances.

That was enlightening.

NT

I've long given up on decipering what trainer's really mean, except I think he likes how RK is doing, he would enter 100 horses if he thought a horse had a chance, and he may or may not be prepping for Delmar.

[nomad]

She barely squeaks out a win in the Vanity against a horse who was trounced by males in her previous start and she is supposed to run in the Gold Cup against the best male in California. Makes sense.

you've got to be kidding

[Indian Charlie]

Nomad, these Zenyattards actually believe this stuff that they post here.

They will grasp at any straw to rationalize Zenyattas connections Bullshid.

[Port Conway Lane]

Nomad, these Zenyattards actually believe this stuff that they post here.

They will grasp at any straw to rationalize Zenyattas connections Bullshid.

The people who demand that Zenyatta run against Rail Trip believe she is vulnerable and want to see her challenged. I would like to see that too but whining about the fact they didn't enter her doesn't get her in the race.

If she makes it to to Kentucky hopefully she will run against the best field available. Meanwhile she has her hands full with St. Trinians who not only challenged her but tested her.

My point in the post that Nomad brought up is that if you were a trainer of a mare who was all out against a horse who was trounced by second tier males in her previous start why would you enter her against the best male in a race that may not meet the time frame you have laid out.

The decision not to run her in the HGC isn't a popular one among racing fans. Maybe we can lay out her schedule for him and while we're at it do the same for the other top horses in training.

[Merlinsky]

The decision not to run her in the HGC isn't a popular one among racing fans. Maybe we can lay out her schedule for him and while we're at it do the same for the other top horses in training.

Now you're talkin'! :D :p

I understand the protectionist attitude even though it irks me. It's been going on for more than just Zenyatta or Rachel, and it's really a tribute to how magnetic and talented they both are that we're griping this loudly. How many owners do the same thing and nobody cares? A trainer will run horses where they can win, and they can get a pat on the back for it. In a situation like this, they get an ear full about how terrible it is that the horse wasn't challenged more.

[RolloTomasi]

The people who demand that Zenyatta run against Rail Trip believe she is vulnerable and want to see her challenged.
This is BS. I doubt anyone wants to see Zenyatta run against Rail Trip because she is "vulnerable". That "you just want to see her lose" defense needs to go to the parking lot. People want to see her run against Rail Trip because she's already shown she can go toe-to-toe with top class males.

Now, your point about her maybe not being in top form right now, based on her narrow victory over St. Trinians is well taken, but that doesn't mean that she's not capable of better than that Vanity effort.

In addition, who said St. Trinians showed her best stuff on Big Cap day? Her other races in the U.S. have been outstanding.

[Port Conway Lane]

This is BS. I doubt anyone wants to see Zenyatta run against Rail Trip because she is "vulnerable". That "you just want to see her lose" defense needs to go to the parking lot. People want to see her run against Rail Trip because she's already shown she can go toe-to-toe with top class males.

Now, your point about her maybe not being in top form right now, based on her narrow victory over St. Trinians is well taken, but that doesn't mean that she's not capable of better than that Vanity effort.

In addition, who said St. Trinians showed her best stuff on Big Cap day? Her other races in the U.S. have been outstanding.

Well I won't speak for anyone else. I think she would be vulnerable.
I agree that perhaps St. Trinians may not have fired that day so that argument is a bit exaggerated.

You say she ran toe-to-toe with top class males. I agree. However (some of) the same people who pretend they want to see her challenged but really want to see her lose will tell you the group of males she beat were a bunch of bums.

I would have loved to see if she was good enough to beat Rail Trip today. It won't happen so I accept it and move on. If she continues to win up to the BCC then her mystique will be unveiled. But even if she wins that race it won't be good enough because she didn't run against males "more than once."

[10 pnt move up]

In addition, who said St. Trinians showed her best stuff on Big Cap day? Her other races in the U.S. have been outstanding.

I must be the only one that thought St Trinians ran really well in the Vanity.

I personally dont think Zenyatta has looked as good as last year, thought given a fall apart pace scenario she could still win any race.

[10 pnt move up]

Man Gayago is a nice looking horse, not sure how he runs today but he looks great.

[RolloTomasi]

I must be the only one that thought St Trinians ran really well in the Vanity.

I personally dont think Zenyatta has looked as good as last year, thought given a fall apart pace scenario she could still win any race.
St. Trinians effort in the Vanity makes one regret her not having started in the Santa Margarita, not to mention any starts she might have made subsequently had Mike Mitchell not backed off on her following the Big Cap debacle.

[Dahoss]

That was some ride by Bejarano.

[RockHardTen1985]

That was some ride by Bejarano.

I thought Richards Kid ran well.

[cmorioles]

Yeah, that makes sense, ship a superior dirt horse across the country to run against poly and turf lovers on polyturf. Great plan. As an aside, I don't think Rail Trip is winning that race.

I'm just saying...

[Dahoss]

I thought Richards Kid ran well.

I thought they all ran like crap. Zenyatta would have won the race by 5. Instead she's in the barn.

[Scav]

I would love for Drugs to get all crunk on Formulator and look at Ron Ellis 3rd/4th/5th off the layoff. He is a great layoff trainer, but when they get into 'campaigns' they seem to tail off.....

That being said, he probably ran the best today being so wide.

[hockey2315]

I'm just saying...

You're not really taking credit for that - are you?

[cmorioles]

You're not really taking credit for that - are you?

I said it early in the thread and I was right...he was 2 to 5. Am I supposed to recant?

[hockey2315]

I know you did. . . Congratulations. He also lost about 10 lengths on the winner trip wise who, as far as I can see, you didn't say you liked anywhere.

[cmorioles]

That is fair, but the race is posted on my site as the race of the week. However, I'm not here to advertise so you'll have to take my word for it. Awesome Gem has been consistently faster than Rail Trip.

As for the losing lengths, I think that is a dubious excuse at best given the race set up. Even so, knowing he was being overrated by many, I was pretty sure he would get an overconfident ride.

[10 pnt move up]

That was some ride by Bejarano.

Not sure what more he can do, the race was a total waste to judge after the fractions.

[10 pnt move up]

That is fair, but the race is posted on my site as the race of the week. However, I'm not here to advertise so you'll have to take my word for it. Awesome Gem has been consistently faster than Rail Trip.

As for the losing lengths, I think that is a dubious excuse at best given the race set up. Even so, knowing he was being overrated by many, I was pretty sure he would get an overconfident ride.

just looked at your figures.......how did you not crush that race?

[Dahoss]

Not sure what more he can do, the race was a total waste to judge after the fractions.

Isn't that what bettors do? We judge the race. The pace was a crawl. Somehow Rail trip was farther off than he should have been and uncovered and wide the entire way. He rode the horse like he couldn't lose and he did.

He still should have won, but that was not one of Bejarano's better rides IMO.

[Scav]

R3: $81.60
R4: $4.00
R5: $159.20

$63,331 was in the pool, and it only paid $5,500, so 11 tickets.

11 tickets had this thing, that seems high for the way the combo sorted out.

[philcski]

R3: $81.60
R4: $4.00
R5: $159.20

$63,331 was in the pool, and it only paid $5,500, so 11 tickets.

11 tickets had this thing, that seems high for the way the combo sorted out.

parlay was $12k for a buck, and honestly the favorite in the middle was probably worth less than $4 in the pick-N pools. All-heavy fave-All is probably a common play in that situation.

[Scav]

parlay was $12k for a buck, and honestly the favorite in the middle was probably worth less than $4 in the pick-N pools. All-heavy fave-All is probably a common play in that situation.

It would have been a $70 ticket, I can't see it...And that horse was a firster who obviously figured but I still think it is very light

[10 pnt move up]

Isn't that what bettors do? We judge the race. The pace was a crawl. Somehow Rail trip was farther off than he should have been and uncovered and wide the entire way. He rode the horse like he couldn't lose and he did.

He still should have won, but that was not one of Bejarano's better rides IMO.

I think he should have been up near the lead but Bejarano can be kinda cute like that, that was a mistake.

After that though not sure if there was a chance for him to alter the strategy.

I don't think Rail Trip is a true 10f horse, the race did not change my view of that.

[Dahoss]

I think he should have been up near the lead but Bejarano can be kinda cute like that, that was a mistake.



So he made a mistake. Good, we agree.

[10 pnt move up]

So he made a mistake. Good, we agree.

what did you think of the ride the place horse got in the last race at belmont today? if ya saw it

[10 pnt move up]

So speaking of rides, I thought that was a very crafty ride by Pedroza on EZ Gentlemen in the Triple Bend.

What a decision it has turned out for Zetcher to turn his horses to Baffert.

[Dahoss]

what did you think of the ride the place horse got in the last race at belmont today? if ya saw it

Did you watch the head on?

I thought the horse was unlucky to lose. Should have won, but when 2 holes close I'm not sure what else could have been done.

[mnmark]

Rail trip actually had an ok trip and took the lead briefly when Awesome Gem had to duck to the rail and accelarate past Rail Trip. I think Awsome Gem would have still won the race had he got Rail Trips trip. He was just better today.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

I would love for Drugs to get all crunk on Formulator and look at Ron Ellis 3rd/4th/5th off the layoff. He is a great layoff trainer, but when they get into 'campaigns' they seem to tail off.....
That being said, he probably ran the best today being so wide.

Considering the fact that he doesn't cheat, he's doing a great job. If it was a level field, his career would have been a lot different.

[miraja2]

The big thing this race pointed out to me is that the sport needs more Awesome Gems.

Some people say that having a horse win the Triple Crown would "save" or "help" horse racing. I say that's nonsense. All that would do is create a superstar horse. Well....the sport has a couple active "superstar" horses and their connections haven't done a damn thing with them in the last 8 months to make this a more interesting sport.

What the sport needs is a bunch of solid, graded-stakes caliber animals like Awesome Gem, where the connections ship all over, take on all comers and put together a career where the horse has faced Midnight Lute, Kip Deville, Curlin, Hard Spun, Global Hunter, Street Sense, Brother Derek, Zenyatta, Heatseeker, Rail Trip, etc.

He loses a lot more than he wins.....and that's okay. At least they aren't scared by shipping him, or by running on a surface or a distance that might not be his absolute best. Last year at this time he was running a game second to Global Hunter in a G1 turf race. Later in the year he bested 10 rivals to win a G2 dirt race. Yesterday he won a G1 race on synthetic. And to top it all off, yesterday was his 11th start in a little over 12 months! What a concept.

[johnny pinwheel]

Richard's Kid should be enough to put down the ridiculous hype that is Rail Trip.

i guess you were not here last year...according to some folks rail trip is a monster. once again he got trounced yesterday. hes a useful horse but hes not that good. i think curlin beat awesome gem by about 12 lengths.....lol...when he was only 4....yeah, rail trip is a world beater...lol...lol

[CSC]

i guess you were not here last year...according to some folks rail trip is a monster. once again he got trounced yesterday. hes a useful horse but hes not that good. i think curlin beat awesome gem by about 12 lengths.....lol...when he was only 4....yeah, rail trip is a world beater...lol...lol

He never demonstated he would be able to get 1 1/4 or carry 123-124 in his career, that should have been enough to scare some people off, but people always gravitate towards cute numbers, exactly the way they will gravitate towards Quality Road in the Classic. Atleast he ran faster than Zenyatta did last month LOL...I'll say it again, people who use these final raw time comparisions including supposedly some sharp players here should know better, or they should by now.

[Indian Charlie]

It's a good thing for Z fans she stayed in the barn yesterday.

Awesome Gem would have smoked her!

[dalakhani]

He never demonstated he would be able to get 1 1/4 or carry 123-124 in his career, that should have been enough to scare some people off, but people always gravitate towards cute numbers, exactly the way they will gravitate towards Quality Road in the Classic. Atleast he ran faster than Zenyatta did last month LOL...I'll say it again, people who use these final raw time comparisions including supposedly some sharp players here should know better, or they should by now.

Rail Trip won this same race last year at 10f. He has won at 121 and 122. In his career, he is now 3-1-1-1 at 10f. Are there any real conclusions to be drawn by this one race other than he isn't invincible?

No disrespect, but this thread was up well before the race yesterday and the only person I saw that posted Rail Trip getting beat was CMorioles.

To me, Rail Trip is still one of the best older horses in the country and if they ship out and he gets a shot on dirt, he will be very dangerous.

[dalakhani]

I would love for Drugs to get all crunk on Formulator and look at Ron Ellis 3rd/4th/5th off the layoff. He is a great layoff trainer, but when they get into 'campaigns' they seem to tail off.....

That being said, he probably ran the best today being so wide.

Rail Trip ran 8 times between Nov 7 2008 until July 11 2009 with no more than a 45 day break between starts. He brought him back for the Pacific classic obviously fearing a bounce from the big Gold Cup performance last year and then put him away for the year.

These days, thats a pretty busy schedule for a horse especially one that has finished out of the exacta one time in his career and that was in a blanket finish where he lost by a length.

Criticism of Ellis is justified in that he might be a little conservative with some of these horses. At the same time, he is more than just a layoff trainer as you suggest.

[CSC]

Rail Trip won this same race last year at 10f. He has won at 121 and 122. In his career, he is now 3-1-1-1 at 10f. Are there any real conclusions to be drawn by this one race other than he isn't invincible?

No disrespect, but this thread was up well before the race yesterday and the only person I saw that posted Rail Trip getting beat was CMorioles.

To me, Rail Trip is still one of the best older horses in the country and if they ship out and he gets a shot on dirt, he will be very dangerous.

I never liked him as much as others, I was one of his more vocal detractors here, it's not about tooting one's horn but I did say Richard's Kid should be enough to put down the ridiculous hype that is Rail Trip in this thread. Wrong horse right idea, maybe at Delmar.

[dalakhani]

I never liked him as much as others, I was one of his more vocal detractors here, it's not about tooting one's horn but I did say Richard's Kid should be enough to put down the ridiculous hype that is Rail Trip in this thread. Wrong horse right idea, maybe at Delmar.

You did say that. I just think that too much is being made of it. He is a nice horse and I don't see anything out there that is much better.

[miraja2]

i guess you were not here last year...according to some folks rail trip is a monster. once again he got trounced yesterday. hes a useful horse but hes not that good. i think curlin beat awesome gem by about 12 lengths.....lol...when he was only 4....yeah, rail trip is a world beater...lol...lol
Saying he is a monster and saying he could pose a serious challenge to Zenyatta are two different things.
I didn't think Rail Trip was great. I don't think many did. I bet against him yesterday (although unfortunately not in a fashion that made me any money). It was the fact that Rail Trip is not a great horse that made the decision to not run Zenyatta in the spot all the more curious.

[OldDog]

The big thing this race pointed out to me is that the sport needs more Awesome Gems.

Some people say that having a horse win the Triple Crown would "save" or "help" horse racing. I say that's nonsense. All that would do is create a superstar horse. Well....the sport has a couple active "superstar" horses and their connections haven't done a damn thing with them in the last 8 months to make this a more interesting sport.

What the sport needs is a bunch of solid, graded-stakes caliber animals like Awesome Gem, where the connections ship all over, take on all comers and put together a career where the horse has faced Midnight Lute, Kip Deville, Curlin, Hard Spun, Global Hunter, Street Sense, Brother Derek, Zenyatta, Heatseeker, Rail Trip, etc.

He loses a lot more than he wins.....and that's okay. At least they aren't scared by shipping him, or by running on a surface or a distance that might not be his absolute best. Last year at this time he was running a game second to Global Hunter in a G1 turf race. Later in the year he bested 10 rivals to win a G2 dirt race. Yesterday he won a G1 race on synthetic. And to top it all off, yesterday was his 11th start in a little over 12 months! What a concept.
:tro:

I really like this horse. Unfortunately we only see this kind of campaigning with geldings. But you've got to love this horse -- he tries every time, is often in the money, and travels far and wide, racing on any surface. THIS is the horse, or kind of horse, that more people should be fans of.

[letswastemoney]

:tro:

I really like this horse. Unfortunately we only see this kind of campaigning with geldings. But you've got to love this horse -- he tries every time, is often in the money, and travels far and wide, racing on any surface. THIS is the horse, or kind of horse, that more people should be fans of.
If I played him on top I'd be a fan ;)

I was certain that either Rail Trip or Richard's Kid, both G1 winners on synthetics, could beat a horse with seconditis and that has never won a stakes on synthetics.

I was wrong.

[AlreadyHome]

AWESOME GEM MADE A GREAT MOVE TO THE RAIL, IT LOOK LIKE HE WANTED TO RUN OPPS CAPS anyways, but yes no where to run an tucked into the rail an open up , great run by Awesome Gem :tro: :{>:


letswastemoney great work on the poster

[OldDog]

I like that Awesome Gem's win is the most popular story at DRF today. :tro:

http://www.drf.com/news/article/114689.html