the mind of the handicapper....

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

as this is a gambling driven sport, i find it very interesting to see why people are the way they are .most cappers by nature are competitive type a personalitys..they have a competitive spirit that makes them the way they are ..To be right means everything......to know you just plucked a 20-1 shot out of thin air and played it correctly is one of the most satisfying pleasures in life..while others scoff at the the how or why..you just knew that the horse was the winner..what does that say about us...and to put so many type a's in a message room is asking for fireworks..this group as a whole is fantastic and i can learn form each of you...is it the money or is it the puzzle..if you have the puzzle figured out you stand to make a few bucks..but in the end is it you just want to be right..and have out smarted the rest of the type a"s....what are your thoughts...this game is an ever flowing set of trails..thanks for being on the derby trail site the best in the game..hooves..:cool: :cool:

[Scav]

the puzzle, and the puzzle for me isn't the handicapping, it is the managing....I get too hyped up and start firing away, like yesterday, I decided to put $500 on that that Broad Brush horse at Belmont with Javy that ran 2nd to Jerkens horse, was just a wrong move at 7/5, I had the cash so I fired, misfired, but still, was moranic, looking back at it....I should have just played the 500 on assussmen's first horse, then rolled that 800 on his 2nd horse....

my thing is that I am not full confident in my handicapping yet. Example, lets say I like a horse that is 10/1 ML that is in the 7th race, I can't play consertive until that, because in my mind, what happens if the 10/1 runs like crap, I will end up with nothing, so I unload early, and end up either unloading on the 10/1 or by the 7th race, putting me last $100 on it in some matter.....

Another example is High Expectations yesterday, KNOWING Arlington, I knew they would play that 10 year old horse Silver Bid that had no shot in winning. The horse still wants to win, but he is not as fast as High Expections, 7/5 was a GIFT on HE, but I only had $100 on it because of stupidity early on....Now, he would been a 7/5 worth putting that 500 on from retarded Javy in 5 horse race, off a layoff...it was moranic.....

[oracle80]

the puzzle, and the puzzle for me isn't the handicapping, it is the managing....I get too hyped up and start firing away, like yesterday, I decided to put $500 on that that Broad Brush horse at Belmont with Javy that ran 2nd to Jerkens horse, was just a wrong move at 7/5, I had the cash so I fired, misfired, but still, was moranic, looking back at it....I should have just played the 500 on assussmen's first horse, then rolled that 800 on his 2nd horse....

my thing is that I am not full confident in my handicapping yet. Example, lets say I like a horse that is 10/1 ML that is in the 7th race, I can't play consertive until that, because in my mind, what happens if the 10/1 runs like crap, I will end up with nothing, so I unload early, and end up either unloading on the 10/1 or by the 7th race, putting me last $100 on it in some matter.....

Another example is High Expectations yesterday, KNOWING Arlington, I knew they would play that 10 year old horse Silver Bid that had no shot in winning. The horse still wants to win, but he is not as fast as High Expections, 7/5 was a GIFT on HE, but I only had $100 on it because of stupidity early on....Now, he would been a 7/5 worth putting that 500 on from retarded Javy in 5 horse race, off a layoff...it was moranic.....


Listen to me my son, the single worst thing anyone can do is to make big win bets on chalk. I cringe when I meet people who do this. Its insanity. You may as well bet sports, you have to be right 60% of the time just to break EVEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No way Tom, no how. Its an exercise in futility.
You say management, I say betting structure. That circle the presses system I showed you on Pik's is one way to give your self a chnace to hit a big one while also providing a break even avenue as well as extra cash on it if the horses you like most score. And its cheaper.
Those big win bets can put you in a deep hole in no time at all if you catch a bad ride or horses gets left at the gate. Once you are in the deep hole emotion creeps in and clouds your judgement. A little to make a lot is better than a lot to make a little.

[Scav]

another thing about this that bankroll and no "outside financial" struggles is the name to this game. Someone that can toss money around can beat this game because of coverage...For example, look at Landson/Mike's pick six at Hollywood, he basically loaned Hollywood $2400 to get back 33k, for three hours......I could never throw 2400 into a ticket like that, that pays my bills for a year. Now, I am not saying that Landson/Mike are just "tossing" money around, but has the capability to do that type of thing

[Scav]

Listen to me my son, the single worst thing anyone can do is to make big win bets on chalk. I cringe when I meet people who do this. Its insanity. You may as well bet sports, you have to be right 60% of the time just to break EVEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No way Tom, no how. Its an exercise in futility.
You say management, I say betting structure. That circle the presses system I showed you on Pik's is one way to give your self a chnace to hit a big one while also providing a break even avenue as well as extra cash on it if the horses you like most score. And its cheaper.
Those big win bets can put you in a deep hole in no time at all if you catch a bad ride or horses gets left at the gate. Once you are in the deep hole emotion creeps in and clouds your judgement. A little to make a lot is better than a lot to make a little.

I agree, but I do think there is certain spots to do it and certain spots not to do it, yesterday was a misguided error. I just hit the early double at Pimilco for $100 so I was a little excited, and fired half of it right back......BUT, a horse like High Expectation at Arlington yesterday, who should have been 3/5 or 4/5, should get unloaded like that...I was so pissed at myself when that horse won yesterday, and for the record, Janks is winning EVERYTHING in site, she is looking to have a HUGE Illinois Day, which is in 3 weeks.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

the puzzle, and the puzzle for me isn't the handicapping, it is the managing....I get too hyped up and start firing away, like yesterday, I decided to put $500 on that that Broad Brush horse at Belmont with Javy that ran 2nd to Jerkens horse, was just a wrong move at 7/5, I had the cash so I fired, misfired, but still, was moranic, looking back at it....I should have just played the 500 on assussmen's first horse, then rolled that 800 on his 2nd horse....

my thing is that I am not full confident in my handicapping yet. Example, lets say I like a horse that is 10/1 ML that is in the 7th race, I can't play consertive until that, because in my mind, what happens if the 10/1 runs like crap, I will end up with nothing, so I unload early, and end up either unloading on the 10/1 or by the 7th race, putting me last $100 on it in some matter.....

Another example is High Expectations yesterday, KNOWING Arlington, I knew they would play that 10 year old horse Silver Bid that had no shot in winning. The horse still wants to win, but he is not as fast as High Expections, 7/5 was a GIFT on HE, but I only had $100 on it because of stupidity early on....Now, he would been a 7/5 worth putting that 500 on from retarded Javy in 5 horse race, off a layoff...it was moranic.....
self reflection and money manegment.....but you like the puzzle ...and mike i personally know players that pound win bets and do very well..they shy away from p-3s and fours

[GPK]

Im just happy to be here. I dont feel like I am a great handicapper, but I do feel as though I have made HUGE strides just in the past 2 years. Hell, 2 years ago I barely knew how to even read a DRF or comprehend PP's. Im sure there are those that feel I still dont know how to comprehend or read them and to my friends that feel that, i say GFY...:D

[oracle80]

another thing about this that bankroll and no "outside financial" struggles is the name to this game. Someone that can toss money around can beat this game because of coverage...For example, look at Landson/Mike's pick six at Hollywood, he basically loaned Hollywood $2400 to get back 33k, for three hours......I could never throw 2400 into a ticket like that, that pays my bills for a year. Now, I am not saying that Landson/Mike are just "tossing" money around, but has the capability to do that type of thing
it was 40 K, you forgot the numerous pik-5's.

[Scav]

you get my point...COMEDY GUY....

[oracle80]

you get my point...COMEDY GUY....
YOu are so easy to get revved up!!!!
Kev has met me, Gander knows me 20 years, Lans and Steve, etc.
The guys who know me dont get offended by my posts. I've got a real dark sense of humor. Most of the time when I seem real angry to you guys, when Im pounding away with caps and exclamation points, IM laughing so hard Im crying. Those guys know me know this, and when they say come on Mike stop, its because they know I am laughing my ass off and smiling as Im acting bent out of shape. I know I should stop, but its just too funnY!!

[Scav]

1) Where the hell is Gander, not even a hello
2) I know....I wasn't sure how many 5's you got

[kentuckyrosesinmay]

Im just happy to be here. I dont feel like I am a great handicapper, but I do feel as though I have made HUGE strides just in the past 2 years. Hell, 2 years ago I barely knew how to even read a DRF or comprehend PP's. Im sure there are those that feel I still dont know how to comprehend or read them and to my friends that feel that, i say GFY...:D

I feel the same way GPK. :D I first started betting when I took a trip to Churchill Downs in 2003 when I went to the Eastern Nationals 4-H Horse Roundup with my NC Hippology team. I got hooked then, although I only bet on big stakes days like Breeder's Cup day.

[oracle80]

1) Where the hell is Gander, not even a hello
2) I know....I wasn't sure how many 5's you got


Scavs, just got a price on a horse I might buy for a client who ran in your backyard. Hop on private message now, please, need some subtlties that you may provide.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

YOu are so easy to get revved up!!!!
Kev has met me, Gander knows me 20 years, Lans and Steve, etc.
The guys who know me dont get offended by my posts. I've got a real dark sense of humor. Most of the time when I seem real angry to you guys, when Im pounding away with caps and exclamation points, IM laughing so hard Im crying. Those guys know me know this, and when they say come on Mike stop, its because they know I am laughing my ass off and smiling as Im acting bent out of shape. I know I should stop, but its just too funnY!!
really you my friend area type a plus with a twist..somebody thanks you for a 6/5 winner and your head gets as big a saratoga..crainus expandus..you need praise to keep you going...lol...:cool:

[oracle80]

really you my friend area type a plus with a twist..somebody thanks you for a 6/5 winner and your head gets as big a saratoga..crainus expandus..you need praise to keep you going...lol...:cool:
Hooves, its part of the schtick, you just dont get it. Like me telling that guy to bow down yesterday, or saying you people are lucky to have me here.
I know it raises a few folks blood pressure and gets em mad. Thats why I do it. I know, I know, I shouldnt do it. But its funny as hell how mad they get.
I was making Buffy so mad for a while that I was afraid she was gonna totally lose it. Its why I stopped, but the guys I know can take it, those are teh guys whose stones I keep busting. I'll try and be a good boy, but trust me, you really dont get my sense of humor yet.

[oracle80]

Hooves,
For example i just sent Scavs a message in which I pretended I was annoyed at him. AT the end of it I asked where the **** his meds were. LOL!!!!
I can't help it man.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

Hooves, its part of the schtick, you just dont get it. Like me telling that guy to bow down yesterday, or saying you people are lucky to have me here.
I know it raises a few folks blood pressure and gets em mad. Thats why I do it. I know, I know, I shouldnt do it. But its funny as hell how mad they get.
I was making Buffy so mad for a while that I was afraid she was gonna totally lose it. Its why I stopped, but the guys I know can take it, those are teh guys whose stones I keep busting. I'll try and be a good boy, but trust me, you really dont get my sense of humor yet.
but i do why do you think i wrote that....i knew you wouldent blow a gasket.....did you get that gift card out of that crack yet,,lol:cool: :cool: :cool:

[oracle80]

but i do why do you think i wrote that....i knew you wouldent blow a gasket.....did you get that gift card out of that crack yet,,lol:cool: :cool: :cool:
LOL!!!! Classic Hooves, I'm mailing it back.
How did you like that "where the **** are your meds Tom?" line/ LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

LOL!!!! Classic Hooves, I'm mailing it back.
How did you like that "where the **** are your meds Tom?" line/ LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
lmfao:cool:

[Buffymommy]

Wait til next week dude. I will get you to blow a gasket. :D

It will be soooooo easy too.

[oracle80]

Wait til next week dude. I will get you to blow a gasket. :D

It will be soooooo easy too.
Why wait til next week? WHy not now? LOL!!! Please don't keep us in suspense.

[Buffymommy]

Why wait til next week? WHy not now? LOL!!! Please don't keep us in suspense.


Hold your horses dude. Next week will come soon enough!

Starting already I am huh?

Just teasing you dude. Calm down.

[oracle80]

Hold your horses dude. Next week will come soon enough!

Starting already I am huh?

Just teasing you dude. Calm down.

LOL!!! Now you finally get it Buffy. Why the hell couldnt you have fired back like this in the first place!! LOL!! Damn, you won't be any fun to pick on anymore, you figured it out. Have to move on to the next victim. Speaking of victims, anybody heard from Seattleallstar?:)

[Buffymommy]

LOL!!! Now you finally get it Buffy. Why the hell couldnt you have fired back like this in the first place!! LOL!! Damn, you won't be any fun to pick on anymore, you figured it out. Have to move on to the next victim. Speaking of victims, anybody heard from Seattleallstar?:)


Be nice Oracle. Why are you being so mean? Why do you like picking on people? I am beginning to think you are insecure...

[oracle80]

Hooves every time Seattleallstar disappears I get real nervous. I pull up the Seattle paper online to check the headlines(I'm quite serious about this). I'm afraid the headline will say "Irate Filipino horseplayer shoots up all you can eat buffet, 20 hurt".

[oracle80]

Be nice Oracle. Why are you being so mean? Why do you like picking on people? I am beginning to think you are insecure...

I'm not being mean, I'm busting Jerry's stones a little. Im actually worried about him, hoping this may draw him out. Even if he just shows up to curse me out, at least I will know he is ok.

[Scav]

The comedy thing is that I know how IRATE Flips can get, I have a flip friend that when he gets mad, he just punchs himself in the head like 10 times, he is a big dude too, like 5'4 350.....

[oracle80]

The comedy thing is that I know how IRATE Flips can get, I have a flip friend that when he gets mad, he just punchs himself in the head like 10 times, he is a big dude too, like 5'4 350.....
Yeah I know, Jerry is like that as well. Hes broken like 5 laptops just since I have known the guy. One time I gave him a horse and it lost, he messages me like a week later and says the horse cost him 3 grand. So I yell at him and ask him why the hell he bet that much. Tells me he only bet one grand, but when it lose he smashed the laptop to pieces and the nice desk that his dad and brother built!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

scavs is the only one who responded to this post..cummon folks is it the puzzle or beating out you fellow cappers and dead money:cool:

[Buffymommy]

scavs is the only one who responded to this post..cummon folks is it the puzzle or beating out you fellow cappers and dead money:cool:


PUZZLE BUT NOT REALLY. I like watching the horsies.... :p

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

PUZZLE BUT NOT REALLY. I like watching the horsies.... :p
hooves bangs head on desk ....over and over...:D

[oracle80]

Hooves,
most great competitors don't love winning, they hate losing.

[Buffymommy]

hooves bangs head on desk ....over and over...:D


Ohhh got you blowing a gasket too.... I am on a roll today. :D

Seriously though, I am not a "gambler" like most of you on the board are. Just bet some here and there on races. Mostly I like to solve the puzzle on who is going to win. Getting better at picking winners. Now I have to work on exactas and quit betting with my heart.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

Ohhh got you blowing a gasket too.... I am on a roll today. :D

Seriously though, I am not a "gambler" like most of you on the board are. Just bet some here and there on races. Mostly I like to solve the puzzle on who is going to win. Getting better at picking winners. Now I have to work on exactas and quit betting with my heart.
you got me buffy...kudos:cool:

[Downthestretch55]

scavs is the only one who responded to this post..cummon folks is it the puzzle or beating out you fellow cappers and dead money:cool:
To me, it's not beating fellow cappers. Heck, I've put out lots of winners.
I do like savying out the puzzle, and it's not just the horses.
I find the people around them intriguing. Always full of hope.
Maybe that's what this world needs more of. Maybe that's what the Bowling Green folks were trying to find in their "study" of Oracle and his "followers".
Those that have convictions that come on strong (defend) are very interesting.
Psychological issues abound.
But, heck, we're all human.
That's the bottom line.
On a side note, think about paying a substantial stud fee and waiting eleven months just to see it born, tack on another two years just to see it hit the track.
Eat all the expenses in between (and there are plenty).
Talk about someone with hope...it just might be me cause that's what I do.
So...there are gamblers and then there are gamblers.
We each do so in our own ways.

DTS

[disappearingdan_akaplaya]

To me, it's not beating fellow cappers. Heck, I've put out lots of winners.
I do like savying out the puzzle, and it's not just the horses.
I find the people around them intriguing. Always full of hope.
Maybe that's what this world needs more of. Maybe that's what the Bowling Green folks were trying to find in their "study" of Oracle and his "followers".
Those that have convictions that come on strong (defend) are very interesting.
Psychological issues abound.
But, heck, we're all human.
That's the bottom line.
On a side note, think about paying a substantial stud fee and waiting eleven months just to see it born, tack on another two years just to see it hit the track.
Eat all the expenses in between (and there are plenty).
Talk about someone with hope...it just might be me cause that's what I do.
So...there are gamblers and then there are gamblers.
We each do so in our own ways.

DTS


GREAT POST DTS! btw CONGRATS ON BDR'S comeback race, a step forward which should happen second off the bench lands ya in the winners circlenext time!

[Togacapper]

What mind ? This game took it from me

[Downthestretch55]

GREAT POST DTS! btw CONGRATS ON BDR'S comeback race, a step forward which should happen second off the bench lands ya in the winners circlenext time!
Thanks Playa,
Ray should do well next out. And I'm waiting to see when Makeitright ships up to Toga. Very high hopes on him (full brother to Darbay's Valentine).
My heart was warmed today when one of my partners, Dee, sent me a picture of Darbay's Valentine standing in the winner's circle at Finger Lakes.
The top part of the picture show him coming "DOWN THE STRETCH"...
and way off to the left side is the nose of the closest horse. Just beautiful!
Unfortunately, Darbay's Valentine is being retired to the farm where my mares and young ones live. It will be a nice place for him.
After he calms down...I will probably take him on the trails.
That's what it's all about.
Sharing good times, good people, beautiful horses.

DTS

[packerbacker7964]

Nodoby listen because I'm going somewhere noone wants to go with this question. I need the Juice. There I said it. I'll say it again I NEED THE MOTHER_UCKING JUICE. Oh man I feel so much better now. No really I can go weeks on end and not go and then go 7 times in two weeks. I don't do the I'm depressed and need my fix it's more like the time of the year. Winter here in West Michigan is something else people. Nothing to do but watch it snow and get deeper by the minute. So I pass the time betting the horse's. Now that summer time is here it's concerts, Weekend Warrior Softball, pro boxing and pool diving going on in my life.

[Togacapper]

DTS, a good friend of mine who is on this board somtimes (Skippaway) bought Silver Colony in last years Saratoga Fall sale. Bred her Prime Timber she is carrying and doing well so far. He's going through the waiting game as he pays his bills etc... We all can't wait to see what this little thing will turn out be> I saw yer post earlier so I thought I would post this.

[Downthestretch55]

DTS, a good friend of mine who is on this board somtimes (Skippaway) bought Silver Colony in last years Saratoga Fall sale. Bred her Prime Timber she is carrying and doing well so far. He's going through the waiting game as he pays his bills etc... We all can't wait to see what this little thing will turn out be> I saw yer post earlier so I thought I would post this.
Togacapper,
Good luck with that one! A Prime Timber should be just grand!
My two new babies, (see nybreds, foaling barn...Harper Farm, Harper Hill Farm, on the foaling barn page)...well, they're what it's all about.
My mare, Bourbon Streettune, is in foal to Best of Luck (High Cliff Farm...it's blue on the right side). I can't wait to see this one. Broad Brush baby!
DTS

[Togacapper]

I will pass this message to my friend you two would have alot to talk about...Best of luck in your venture.It would be nice to see both of your horses in the circle

[Downthestretch55]

Thanks Togacapper,
I'd like to meet up with your friend.
The farm is a little over an hour from Toga...figure an hour and a half.
Sumitas, a guy who posts on the ESPN board, got into breeding when I found a partnership for him on a nice mare named Lizoranet. She's now in foal to Desert Warrior. He's thrilled!
Lizoranet foaled a beauty that sold for about 30K last year. Sire was Wheelaway (McMahon's of Saratoga). Her baby by AP Jet didn't make it to term. So, now the expectation of the "next".
There are some pretty good opportunities for NY breeders.
If I ever have someone with "deep pockets" that would like to do a couple of "pin hooks" out of the Fasig Tipton Fall sale (toga)...plenty could be made.
In my humble opinion, lots of very well bred NY horse are being overlooked.
Bargains abound.
DTS

[Togacapper]

I' will make sure you two talk. He I'm sure will be excited to speak to someone in the same situation he is in, and also with the knowledge of breeding that you seem to have. His Mare is at a private farm in Ballston Spa, Ny.

[Downthestretch55]

I look forward to meeting you and your friend.
Mike (Oracle) has my e-mail address. Meet up with Mike for drinks like he invited.
Or, I'll be at Toga this summer. I swing by Steve's B-B-Q often.
Maybe we can meet up there.
DTS

[Togacapper]

Sure that would be fine. We are at the track all the time. Always a table in Caousel club house.Hoping to meet up with Mike this weekend. But I think he's going to New York I opted not this year.

[Downthestretch55]

TC,
That's great. I'll meet up with you and your friend at Steve's this summer.
It's Carolina Bar-B Que, the one to the left of the grand stand gate.
He'll be there. Nice guy. Pure heart.
And, if you read the ESPN board, he's kind of outraged about the lack of respect he's been given for providing us with this board and opportunities.
He's the real deal. Doesn't deserve the "trashing" from idiots.
Is this how some thank him for his efforts?
I'll meet up with you there during the meet.
DTS

[Togacapper]

Sounds great DTS. Just name the day. And as for Steve I listen to him all the time. And what a great board. Never posted on the ESPN board just always read...seemed hectic.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Hooves,I think most people who really like to gamble on horses do it for 3 reasons.I think horseracing is very intense around the far turn,and through the stretch.Intense enough that people can get a very good escape from whatever it is that they don't want to think about.If people are stressed about Work,illness,money ,failed relationships, or whatever it is.This sport works better than most sports do to disconnect a person's mind from their problems or concerns.I am not saying people feel bad,and say I am gunna bet horses to feel better.I am saying that subconciously the pleasure from playing horses comes from this disconnecting with reality.You may just think you do it for "the fun."I think for most people part of "the fun" is being totally disconnected from your normal worries,and concerns(mainly subconcious.)I think what many call "the juice" is this time when they are so into the fight in front of them that they are free from everything else in their lives(for that 15 seconds or whatever it may be.)This is what sporting events are..escapes from reality.

1)escape

2)solving a puzzle

3)trying to make money

[Danzig]

Hooves,
most great competitors don't love winning, they hate losing.


that would be me....

[SCUDSBROTHER]

that would be me....


I think great competitors love to win,but the pleasure of winning does not make up for the pain they feel from losing.Case in point...Chris McCarron is still in pain from the '87 Breeders Cup Classic,and the loss in the Derby on Cavonnier.

[Danzig]

yeah, it should be great competitors love to win, but not quite as much as they hate to lose.

[randallscott35]

I don't mind losing a horse race wager as much as a sports wager. Its nice to be able to win or lose in 1:09. You lose, its quick and painless, not worrying about every tip of the ball or error. You win, its a nice rush and then a wait till the next race....I agree with Mike about chalk. I don't bet it. Usually I'll avoid the race, and or use the horse in a double or exacta. I'm a bombs away guy. Yesterday I was down a few hundred before the 5th at Churchill. Got the 10-1 home and ended up a nickel on the day. I don't mind firing at the value. You don't have to be right all the time at longshot odds. At chalk odds, you absolutely do.

[timmgirvan]

Hooves: It's the puzzle first, and the cash next, and then the competition!

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

nice posts scuds and randall..escape is a good word...:cool: :cool:

[pgardn]

2)solving a puzzle

Its all this for me. And its a puzzle that does not play fair. When you hit a horse that wins easily, and is a long shot, you found something few others did. That is very satisfying. But the patience required to allow those few moments to rise up are few and far between. So good luck to those that actually try to make money at this.

This is entertainment that you actually participate in. This not sitting back and watching a movie or reading a book. This sport involves predicting outcomes. And its an art and science mixture. The game is elusive and that makes it that much more interesting than other forms of entertainment. We have all seen the compulsives... but this is actually an intellectual game that does not play fairly. You can solve a problem in some other activity and you are done. This game does not end.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

allright pgrdn and timmy g....great anyone else....:cool:

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Scavs,Oracle tried to tell you to avoid betting these big win bets on Chalk.

Let me give you a couple reasons why it is a bad idea.Let's assume you play a $500 pick 6 with a take out of 25%...You give up $125 in take out once in a racecard,but for what possible reward? Who knows..Right?Could be 40k...Now compare that to the bet you described earlier($500 to win on a 7/5 shot.)You give up 18.5% right away=$92.50..if you bet an offshore it's 7% less...$57.50...Now what is the most you can possibly get back? $1200 total..O.K...Now what are you gunna do? You going home? Most guys are gunna keep betting.Depending on whether you win another race or not,you can keep pushing that money back and forth all night at a cost of 18.5%,or 11.5%. Your pssn away money that way(in takeout.)Probably another $100,or $200.Be smarter.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

Scavs,Oracle tried to tell you to avoid betting these big win bets on Chalk.

Let me give you a couple reasons why it is a bad idea.Let's assume you play a $500 pick 6 with a take out of 25%...You give up $125 in take out once in a racecard,but for what possible reward? Who knows..Right?Could be 40k...Now compare that to the bet you described earlier($500 to win on a 7/5 shot.)You give up 18.5% right away=$92.50..if you bet an offshore it's 7% less...$57.50...Now what is the most you can possibly get back? $1200 total..O.K...Now what are you gunna do? You going home? Most guys are gunna keep betting.Depending on whether you win another race or not,you can keep pushing that money back and forth all night at a cost of 18.5%,or 11.5%. Your pssn away money that way(in takeout.)Probably another $100,or $200.Be smarter.
i d ont know if it was intentional chalk betting..if you lay down at 5-6 to 1 at 10 min to post...tick tick tick next thing you know its freakin 6/5...i hate that...

[Pointg5]

Figuring out the winner, gives me a rush, especially if the race unfolds as aexactly as you thought it would, I am wrong more often than I am right, but when you get it right, more than makes up for the wrongs.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

Hooves: It's the puzzle first, and the cash next, and then the competition!
timmy g are you bill or ted?....san d ca...is there really a circle k lol:cool:

[Downthestretch55]

2)solving a puzzle

Its all this for me. And its a puzzle that does not play fair. When you hit a horse that wins easily, and is a long shot, you found something few others did. That is very satisfying. But the patience required to allow those few moments to rise up are few and far between. So good luck to those that actually try to make money at this.

This is entertainment that you actually participate in. This not sitting back and watching a movie or reading a book. This sport involves predicting outcomes. And its an art and science mixture. The game is elusive and that makes it that much more interesting than other forms of entertainment. We have all seen the compulsives... but this is actually an intellectual game that does not play fairly. You can solve a problem in some other activity and you are done. This game does not end.
Pat,
I couldn't agree more. It really IS an art and a science.
Predicting outcomes, now there's the puzzle.
To me, it comes from something deeper than anything that is quantifiable, much more "human".
It's called hope.
It's exactly the same psychological motivation as to why people show up in church every Sunday.
The thing that intrigues me is that so many quest the same answers, despite different venues.

"Do I want to go to heaven? Or can I avoid going to Hell?"

To me, it continues to be very interesting.
When I find the answer to the puzzle, I'll let you know, but I don't expect that I'll find it in this life.
I also hope.
On a very basic level, that's what most of this is about. (HOPE)

DTS

[Togacapper]

Great posts GTS,PG..

[Thunder Gulch]

The joy of handicapping is the intellectual challenge picking winners for me. Though I follow racing consistently, I don't play more than 15 days a year, so the money is somewhat secondary, though I like winning as much as the next guy. I do expect to win, but being brutally realistic, the days I go are often the toughest cards of the year and breaking even is a challenge. I'm confident in my handicapping and feel like I am as good as any intermediate player on most days. However, I have a family and a nice career, so having the time to watch races and put the work that it takes into winning daily isn't feasible. Build a pile of money, retire at 50, and then see what I can do with racing down the road...on the other hand, I play sports betting to win money. Don't confuse that with being a handicapper. Much like racing, I know I can't put in 60 hours a week on that, but I am not ashamed to admit that I purchase selections from pros that I have been with for 10 years. Before some of you rush to condemn me, consider that I am a winning gambler while 99.9% of the guys who are too proud to pay for information are losing on their own picks..

[timmgirvan]

timmy g are you bill or ted?....san d ca...is there really a circle k lol:cool:
DUDE: the Circle K is 150 yds from my apartment!!! Alas, I dont remember the movie very well!!!

[GPK]

To me its the joy of picking winners, especially the higher odds horses. Seeing something the very few others see. A sense of pride really.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

To me its the joy of picking winners, especially the higher odds horses. Seeing something the very few others see. A sense of pride really.
the terror of tampa bay...................:cool: :cool:

[FlaFemFatale]

To me it's the puzzle first & foremost.
Then there's the color;pageantry and seeing the perefct "running machines" take to the track.
Then watching the one you gleaned out of the pp's start that run at the 3/8's pole; sweep around horses on the turn and collar the leader 100 yds from the finish.
Then the finale.....cashing your winning ticket, with a broad smile, and a feeling of utter accomplishment.

You can't get all 4 of those things gambling on any other sporting event.Occasionally you get the 70yrd touchdoen pass in the final seconds of the football game that enables you to beat the spread. And occasionally you get that third ace on the river. And both of these events are a rush, it's true; but they don't happen very often (at least not as often as seeing your pick come thundering down the stretch, pasing all those in his way).
And in none of the other games of chance, do you have as much to decipher, and as fulfilled a feeling after deciphering.
It's the greatest game.

[Downthestretch55]

To me it's the puzzle first & foremost.
Then there's the color;pageantry and seeing the perefct "running machines" take to the track.
Then watching the one you gleaned out of the pp's start that run at the 3/8's pole; sweep around horses on the turn and collar the leader 100 yds from the finish.
Then the finale.....cashing your winning ticket, with a broad smile, and a feeling of utter accomplishment.

You can't get all 4 of those things gambling on any other sporting event.Occasionally you get the 70yrd touchdoen pass in the final seconds of the football game that enables you to beat the spread. And occasionally you get that third ace on the river. And both of these events are a rush, it's true; but they don't happen very often (at least not as often as seeing your pick come thundering down the stretch, pasing all those in his way).
And in none of the other games of chance, do you have as much to decipher, and as fulfilled a feeling after deciphering.
It's the greatest game.
Yes, yes...
Now think about this for a moment if you will allow me...
You find a really nice brood mare,
You search for the right "match" for her...compensate for her "defects".
You pay a very big stud fee.
You wait.
Then wait a lot more.
Then comes the day when it's born and tries to find its way to its little wobbly legs. Life.
Then more waiting, watching it play with the other foals in the pasture.
Then the time to train.
Start it slow, break it to lead, then the bit, next a light saddle.
Then you roll over its back, and later, after it trusts you enough, it lets you climb on to its back.
Then some easy rides with a retired pony horse (just so it feels a bit less threatened).

Next, the real training....the folks that you trust to make something more of what you've already invested so much time and effort into.
You watch the clock.
you hope they don't wreck him/her.
You hope it stays sound.
And then, one day...it shows up in the paddock wearing your silks.
The post parade, the gate, the break...

All I'm trying to say is that there is so, so much more than the final 3/8, though it brings the same lump in my throat when I see that special moment.
So much goes in before anything worthwhile comes out....

As I've heard said, "All in the blink of a moment...is all eternity".

That's what it is to me. Life.

DTS

[FlaFemFatale]

Yes, yes...
Now think about this for a moment if you will allow me...
You find a really nice brood mare,
You search for the right "match" for her...compensate for her "defects".
You pay a very big stud fee.
You wait.
Then wait a lot more.
Then comes the day when it's born and tries to find its way to its little wobbly legs. Life.
Then more waiting, watching it play with the other foals in the pasture.
Then the time to train.
Start it slow, break it to lead, then the bit, next a light saddle.
Then you roll over its back, and later, after it trusts you enough, it lets you climb on to its back.
Then some easy rides with a retired pony horse (just so it feels a bit less threatened).

Next, the real training....the folks that you trust to make something more of what you've already invested so much time and effort into.
You watch the clock.
you hope they don't wreck him/her.
You hope it stays sound.
And then, one day...it shows up in the paddock wearing your silks.
The post parade, the gate, the break...

All I'm trying to say is that there is so, so much more than the final 3/8, though it brings the same lump in my throat when I see that special moment.
So much goes in before anything worthwhile comes out....

As I've heard said, "All in the blink of a moment...is all eternity".

That's what it is to me. Life.

DTS

Nice post-------------------------you write as an owner and I write as a handicapper. I've been both and both have their ups and downs, but I wouldn't trade any of either experience, because nothing else is like it.

[Samarta]

To me its the joy of picking winners, especially the higher odds horses. Seeing something the very few others see. A sense of pride really.
agreed....but you know what takes it to the next level for me is being there, without any forms, pp's, or odds boards and being able to spot that special something by how a horse looks. how they react in the paddock, when they are saddled, in the post parade and if you are right in your hunch the thrill is just as great whether you have no money or a bunch of money riding on it. It's about the love of the game and the animal as much as it is cashing a ticket....for me anyway.....